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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2018 7:38 pm 
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848cc
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Has anyone fitted the complete rover single point injection system to a earlier a series 1275?

I’m considering fuel injection for my project car, partly as my wife has shown an interest in driving it regularly and I’m interested in fuel injection.

I’ve read some reports that it’s the worst possible option, and some that say it’s good up to about 80-85 bhp.

I’ve also looked at megajolt/megasquirt, but why not just use factory bits?

I’m only looking at single point injection, not multi point, as I know charge robbing is an issue for 5 port heads.

The car is going to be built to be reliable and fun and not heavy on fuel, not to win dyno days or any serious competition.

Any thoughts appreciated.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2018 8:14 pm 
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1275cc
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Joined: Sun Apr 29, 2012 1:19 pm
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Location: Wollongong, NSW
I've seen a nice conversion here with plenty of details:
http://www.theminiforum.co.uk/forums/to ... onversion/

Another:
https://www.aronline.co.uk/cars/mini-cl ... onversion/

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2018 8:21 pm 
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1098cc
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Joined: Sat Jul 23, 2011 8:17 am
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Location: san remo nsw
I have an SPI Rover and looking at it as a retrofit to an early car wouldn't be too hard if you get all the parts. Probably cheap as spares from UK. About the only glitch would be the Crank sensor,you'd need to make 36 notch wheel with 2 180deg spaced gaps.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2018 8:52 pm 
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848cc
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Thanks Timmy and Peter. I already have the motor, needs rebuild, and the gearbox is already rebuilt. So I’m looking to fit this to a pre a plus 1275. As far as I can tell the mpi system picks up the crank signal from the flywheel, and there’s no distributor hole in the block. I don’t want to change flywheel, transfer case and gearbox, so that’s the mpi out unless I can mount a trigger wheel the same pattern on the crank pulley.

I’d get the ARDUINO system, but I can’t put together the computer circuits.

I think the spi gets its crank angle signal from the distributor, can someone confirm?

I’m liking the spi the more I look at it, shouldn’t be too hard to get a system from a breaker in the uk. Minimania have a spi set up secondhand for usd$600 plus post. I don’t need the tank or pump as I think I’d do a deadhead system under the boot floor to keep it quiet.

How much better is the mpi system over the spi?

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Lindsay Palmer
06 Mazda SP23
80 Alfa GTV (weekend toy)
86 626 Turbo (daily drive, now stolen)
71 cooper s replica
69 cooper replica
76 clubman
62 english 850
68 Mini Auto


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 6:49 am 
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848cc
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Did a bit more reading last night and found that both the mpi and spi use a trigger on the flywheel. Makes the conversion a bit harder but not impossible.

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Lindsay Palmer
06 Mazda SP23
80 Alfa GTV (weekend toy)
86 626 Turbo (daily drive, now stolen)
71 cooper s replica
69 cooper replica
76 clubman
62 english 850
68 Mini Auto


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 9:37 am 
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Joined: Wed Sep 08, 2004 9:27 pm
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Location: Wodonga - Vic/NSW border
If you're interested in fuel injection, and want to understand it in depth, then I can recommend megasquirt. You can make a really neat setup quite cheaply with minimal soldering, but with absolute control.

I'm running an MS3 - I've taken my injection off but I'm still using it for ignition. I was using a nissan throttle body (with TPS) and an IAC that I think was from a Holden

I wouldn't use factory bits... not enough control - you can't change the ignition and fuel maps for starters.

For reliability, I can't go past the HIF44 I put on after I took my injection and blower off - no matter how cold the morning is, I can reach in the door, pull the choke out and turn the key - it just starts and I can drive it straight away. I won't put injection back on until I can get a 7 port head

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 10:49 am 
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Location: Wodonga - Vic/NSW border
if you want to talk to someone about Megasquirt, there is a bloke named Jared in NZ who comes across as a straight talker and sells them ready to go, setup to your needs - https://www.megasquirtnz.co.nz/ - send him an email

I'm just completing an MS3 setup on a Honda for someone. I didn't end up buying the gear from him because I wanted to go a different direction to what he suggested, but he was happy to advise.

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 8:47 pm 
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848cc
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Simon, thanks for the reply. Maybe microsquirt controlling a single point injection set up could work. I did some reading up on microsquirt today.

How do you find the hif44? I have a megajolt set up for tps in the shed, which I think can be converted to map sensor. I got the option of a 45 dcoe Weber with a tps, hif44 su or twin su s. I like the idea of injection for reliability, economy and power. My last experience with webers on minis was ok, except the fuel bill, but the car did get driven hard. The hif44 is still in the box I got it in.

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06 Mazda SP23
80 Alfa GTV (weekend toy)
86 626 Turbo (daily drive, now stolen)
71 cooper s replica
69 cooper replica
76 clubman
62 english 850
68 Mini Auto


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 8:56 pm 
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1360cc
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Joined: Mon Aug 23, 2004 10:07 pm
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Location: SE Melbourne
Putting a factory SPI system onto an earlier engine would involve the following:
1. (Preferable items) having the injection type cam in the engine and an SPI fuel tank and charcoal canister (to make use of the purge valve).
2. If using a factory computer, you would need to get the crank angle sensor into the correct spot under the starter motor behind the flywheel - either by using an A+ spi clutch cover (inner) or by drilling the required holes into the right spot but that could be hard. You'd then need to fit the correct SPI flywheel - note that there are different versions of SPI flywheels and they have the triggers in different positions so this needs to match the correct computer.


If you're going to use a megasquirt or similar system and a custom 36-1 wheel and just the factory inlet manifold then the operation can probably be simplified in terms of its 'bolt on' side of things, it just requires potentially more cost and all the fiddly programming and tuning and if that isn't done right then you may loose the reliability component of the SPI system - which just makes it an expensive carby that doesnt work properly compared to a real carby that properly set up will always work correctly.


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 9:08 pm 
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Lindsay_Palmer wrote:
Simon, thanks for the reply. Maybe microsquirt controlling a single point injection set up could work. I did some reading up on microsquirt today.

How do you find the hif44? I have a megajolt set up for tps in the shed, which I think can be converted to map sensor. I got the option of a 45 dcoe Weber with a tps, hif44 su or twin su s. I like the idea of injection for reliability, economy and power. My last experience with webers on minis was ok, except the fuel bill, but the car did get driven hard. The hif44 is still in the box I got it in.


The HIF44 is great, very economical - no idea what the power figures are like but it performs well enough for me... goes well in motorkhanas and occasionally on the track

I rebuilt the carb and set it up very carefully and did a lot of thinking on needles - I also have an AFR gauge on the car which means I can really keep an eye on mixtures. I get a really good 14.5 to 15:1 when cruising, 12:1-ish under power, just where it's meant to be

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 9:44 pm 
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998cc
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Joined: Sun Nov 06, 2005 5:41 pm
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Location: Adelaide
What do you need to do on the fuel system? Does the SPI / MPI run a high pressure pump in the tank with return to tank? Does the fuel line size need to be larger with decent filter to protect the injector/s?


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 10:26 pm 
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5/16" pressure and return fuel line. Low pressure efi pump on spi, and good fuel filter as mentioned.


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 10:39 pm 
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848cc
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Thank you for all the input everyone. More thinking and reading I think.

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Lindsay Palmer
06 Mazda SP23
80 Alfa GTV (weekend toy)
86 626 Turbo (daily drive, now stolen)
71 cooper s replica
69 cooper replica
76 clubman
62 english 850
68 Mini Auto


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 5:40 pm 
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Location: Wodonga - Vic/NSW border
IndigoBlueCooperS wrote:
What do you need to do on the fuel system? Does the SPI / MPI run a high pressure pump in the tank with return to tank? Does the fuel line size need to be larger with decent filter to protect the injector/s?


I didn't bother changing fuel lines - I stuck with the standard 1/4" fuel line from the tank to the fuel rail. I had a filter into a pump under the boot floor, the regulator straight after that going up into top of the tank and forward into the standard fuel line. Ran 100bhp ATW with 12:1 AFRs as long as I wanted, no fuel pressure loss

The only fuel problem I had was trying to pull fuel from both tanks but only returning into the left - kinda overflowed it :roll:

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 9:44 pm 
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Simon, How did you overcome the RH tank overfilling?


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