They sold my old 68' Deluxe a fair few months back I think.

I thought it was a bit high considering it not having the plate (1970) and the front end hit it has obviously had.

Steve

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1964 998cc Cooper
1971 Mini K x 2
1972 Clubman GT

ah... forgot the ID plate

never mind, I still want to know who got it

if anyone knows and they don't want it publicised, please put me in contact privately

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did I tell you that I won a trophy?

The ID plate (compliance plate actually) is a bit of a strange one for value. If it had been made a year earlier it wouldn't have had any plate. But since it is a 70 it would have had a compliance plate.

But does the lack of a plate make it any less a Cooper S?

I recall the thread where we discussed the wey that the 70 models plates would corrode due to the way they were mounted.

While the lack of a plate does not make it any less of a car I do believe that it does and should make a difference to value. If there were 2 otherwise identical cars side by side and for sale, the only difference being one with a plate and one without, which one is worth more?

I think we all know the answer

Cheers
Steve

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1964 998cc Cooper
1971 Mini K x 2
1972 Clubman GT

There were only a very few 69 S's without plates, spanning 2 1/2 months, Yet I have seen more "early" 69 models than you can poke a stick at. I personally would never own an S without a plate unless it had a history to prove it was one of those early MK2's. Until recently my father was the second owner of a MK 1 1/2, which had all the original pruchase documents etc and was totally original and unrestored. Even then people would still question its validity until its history was told. Does not having a plate make this 1970 car any less of a Cooper S. Your damn right it does. WIthout the correct identification all you have is a mini shell with S type tags and brackets. I would be more concerned about where that plate actually is. Is it currently on a car that is rego'd with those numbers. If so you have a good fight on your hands proving who owns those numbers.

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1970 Cooper S ex-Bathurst & ATCC
1964 Austin Cooper S ex-Group C race car
1967 Morris Cooper S ex-Group B
1962 Mini Speed sports sedan
1968-71 ex-Peter Manton Shell car

Very well said about the identification ....... However the 1969 S was produced from May 1969 , through to sometime in December 1969 without a Compliance Plate , a period of about 8 months , in which time there would have been around 800 - 900 cars produced ....... I believe that some cars were produced late December 1969 with a Compliance Plate ...

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1965 Morris 850
1966 Morris Mini Minor
1967 Morris Cooper 'S'
1977 Leyland LS

Umm, without the compliance plate you still have a Cooper S with all the numbers still stamped on the body in the right places.
You can still register a car without a compliance plate. You can still prove the identity of the car.
Being a 1970 car the original plate probably had a hole corroded through the car number anyway. (just like a lot of cars I have looked at)

You need to look at everything and not just the plate.

what about a MK2 that is missing the compliance plate, and has had the radiator shroud cut off to fit a thermo fan - 100% a genuine S, but no identifiers....

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did I tell you that I won a trophy?

I could still identify if it was real or not.

Making a fake Cooper S is not difficult. Having judged concourse cars for many years and winning RACQ restored car of the year in 99 for a MK 2 S, all the things that make an S shell an S shell are easy to reproduce, and nobody will EVER pick it. But would that make it an S? Absolutely not. You are right it is the car in the entirety, and any less than that is merely a compromise, that reduces the desirability and value of the vehicle. As for the build dates for the MK 2 without plates, I contacted my father who still has a copy of the BMC memorandum from his old MK 1 1/2, that the original owner had passed on clearly states that the vehicles that were produced from June 1969 to September 1969 (a maximum of 3 months) were not fitted with ID plates and that all references to the vehicle back to BMC for servicing should be made by the chassis no stamped on the radiator shroud.

as an aside: About 15+ years ago I produced a booklet I titled "Cooper S the original story" that I circulated to many people in the old QLD mini car club, after spending weeks sifting through memorabilia that the old man and I collected over the years. Had a very detailed list of chassis numbers and engine numbers as well as body colours for certain cars that we knew were very original over the years. Was a much more detailed list than what I can get my hands on these days. I have lost my own copy of that and would love a photocopy back from someone if they still have it. Would save me doing it again, and dont have the time these days.

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1970 Cooper S ex-Bathurst & ATCC
1964 Austin Cooper S ex-Group C race car
1967 Morris Cooper S ex-Group B
1962 Mini Speed sports sedan
1968-71 ex-Peter Manton Shell car

No such thing as a Mk 1 1/2 . Have a read of Watto's excellent articles in The Mini Experience , issue 14 'Mystery Machines - 1969 Cooper S' and ' Identifying The 1969 Cooper S ' , hes really done his research

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1965 Morris 850
1966 Morris Mini Minor
1967 Morris Cooper 'S'
1977 Leyland LS

Has anyone ever seen a Mini (not just a Cooper S but any Mini or Morris or Austin) made in October or November 69 that was fitted with a compliance plate?
The earliest compliance plate that I have seen is December 69. When you consider the fact that the Compliance plate had to be fitted from 1st Jan 1970 that would make a lot of sense.

ID plates ????????? It would be interesting to see that memorandum . I have seen lots of genuine 1969 morris cars from June through to December that don't have a Compliance Plate and I have seen a late December 1969 Cooper S WITH its Compliance Plate

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1965 Morris 850
1966 Morris Mini Minor
1967 Morris Cooper 'S'
1977 Leyland LS

Hey settle down there big nuts. The changeover car from mk 1 to 2 is most often loosely referred to as a MK 1 1/2. PM me with a fax I will get my father to fax you a copy. My father was given a copy from someone years ago when worried about why his car nad no plate. I have no reason to argue with you. Not that I doubt anything I read in magazines or newspapers.

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1970 Cooper S ex-Bathurst & ATCC
1964 Austin Cooper S ex-Group C race car
1967 Morris Cooper S ex-Group B
1962 Mini Speed sports sedan
1968-71 ex-Peter Manton Shell car