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shudder and die out
https://www.ausmini.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1050		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  68matic [ Mon Jul 05, 2004 7:18 pm ]
Post subject:  shudder and die out
oil change (Penrite Classic Light), brake adjustment yesterday,
spark plug replacement today,
33,800 miles, had been running fine since 30,700 10months ago when i got it, if not perfectly

now engine (rather suddenly) is noisy, inconsistent, and this morning in traffic (going for bike Ps test on a strict time), coming home and going to get bread,
the engine doesnt fire as consistently or quiet as normal.
after pulsating for about 5 minutes, the engine dies out
and i have to put it back in neutral, start it, rev it up, and put it into gear.

after our family car was put at the panel beaters last friday, my mini has been relied on since (3days).
i dont know if it is the insecurity of not having another car at home to rescue me, or the tragedies that have been happening,
im feeling quite down and envy anyone else with a more reliable car(or perhaps a newer car--- eeek!).

can my problem be fixed to get my esteem back up?
dad says its the carby that needs a fix, its not providing enough air and needs a tune
Author:  drmini in aust [ Mon Jul 05, 2004 7:22 pm ]
Post subject: 
Don't assume it's (always) the carby.... often it's something else.
I'd check the points gap first. When they close up close the motor runs like a dog- surging, missing, inconsistent running.

Also check for loose connections on the coil and inside the dizzy.

And what plugs did you fit? Seems funny it started straight after you changed them.. :wink:
Author:  68matic [ Mon Jul 05, 2004 7:27 pm ]
Post subject: 
the problem happened yesterday before the plug change
they were cleaned last night, the car was tested

this morning in the cold (water temp quiet cold) it still happened
after changing the plugs,
the problem persisted even at a very warm temp

thanks Doc, ill have a look at the dizzy and points

also when i cleaned out the oil, the bolt has a magnet attached to it
and it was covered in more metal sludge than ever (only after 1000 miles)
Author:  gafmo [ Mon Jul 05, 2004 10:19 pm ]
Post subject: 
Sorry I agree with the Doc.

have another look at the points. You may have checked them but they still may have closed up. I don't think it Fuel.
Does it Rev nicely without being in Gear, if so its deftentnly not fuel. Have you changed anything other than plugs.

Check the the Dizzy cap also it may have a crack if you have touched it, only a thought

let us know
Author:  sociallydisabled [ Mon Jul 05, 2004 10:22 pm ]
Post subject: 
what is the points gap?
go team newbie :lol: although i am learning
Author:  drmini in aust [ Mon Jul 05, 2004 10:31 pm ]
Post subject: 
.015", (0.4mm) with the heel of the points arm right on top of the cam lobe.
Author:  sociallydisabled [ Mon Jul 05, 2004 10:35 pm ]
Post subject: 
:D i have no idea...shall i just not worry haha htnks anyway 8) dont even know where these points are....
Author:  gafmo [ Mon Jul 05, 2004 10:52 pm ]
Post subject: 
Sorry SD but Lamens Terms mate
Author:  Mike [ Tue Jul 06, 2004 4:04 am ]
Post subject: 
Also make sure that the dizzy isnt moving within its bracket (ie that the pinch bolt is tight).
Author:  Lillee [ Tue Jul 06, 2004 9:47 am ]
Post subject: 
This may sound dumb but did you connect the spark leads back in the same order as it was originally??
Author:  thommo09 [ Tue Jul 06, 2004 12:24 pm ]
Post subject: 
i dont think it'd run at all if the leads were in the wrong order 68
Author:  PhildoD [ Tue Jul 06, 2004 6:07 pm ]
Post subject: 
ok, while the problem may not be the carby, it IS quite possible you may have a batch of bad fuel or a fuel FEED problem.

since the guys have already suggested most of the electrical side, I'll go the way of fuel.

If you have any of the following fitted, I would check in order:
1. Fuel filter
2. Electrical fuel pump for wavering or intermittent operation/Mechanical fuel pump for leakage or air coming through the line after the pump.
3. Carby fuel bowl for sediment and the needle and seat for any residue.
Author:  min13k [ Wed Jul 07, 2004 7:46 am ]
Post subject: 
dok if it is still playing up on the weekend i'll drop over and have a look kk
uncle dave is coming over sat to put the head on and adjust the tappets and other stuff
makka
Author:  68matic [ Wed Jul 07, 2004 12:15 pm ]
Post subject: 
thank you everyone
here are some more observations:

1. there is a saucer-shaped thing running from a back plate in the engine block to the inlet manifold. ive been told this reburns crap
on the saucer shaped thing, there is a tiny hole (supposed to be there). when you put your finger over it, the engine sounds like its going to choke and die

you can see it in the right hand corner at http://www.angelfire.com/mech/ducho/engine_bay.JPG (cut n paste link)
tube running behind rocker cover, under blue tube, then the saucer and it goes down behind the engine

2. i took the air filter out and it seemed to run louder and rougher (perhaps even more confidently), but the problem still occurred when run without the air filter.

3. i filled up with BP ultimate on saturday. changed the oil (not the filter) sunday. problem started sunday night.
problem continued monday after plug change.
i dont think i have a fuel filter

4. ive been told you need to know what youre doing for a points gap check. Three people have agreed it might be the points gap thingy

i will do everything i can (carby clean out, points clean, breather valve saucer thingy clean)

i really want to make it to sunday eastern creek, maybe makka ill see you if the problem cant be fixed thanks

thank you everybody i appreciate it all
Author:  Mike [ Thu Jul 08, 2004 2:58 am ]
Post subject: 
The saucer thing is a smith's device the name of which I can never remember, but its there between the breather for your engine and the manifold. Its basicaly a diafragm which allows passage of gas in one direction only (to your manifold). When the pressure inside your block rises it allows the excess gas to be sucked off by the vacume in the manifold. They often dont work (and you see people puting individual filters on their breathers). You can test by blowing through it and ensuring that gas passes smouthly in one direction and holds pressure in the other.

If its blocked you'd only feel the difference (I think) at high revs with a hot engine - when the pressure inside the engine has nowhere to escape. You can test it though by disconecting the hose to the manifold and sealing it.

Idealy with an efficient air filter there should be a minimal difference b/w filter on and off (saying just in general, it is the case with other cars and it is the case with my k&ns) in your case you might also be running too rich as the filter enrichens the mixture by blocking off air.

- Run a search of topics - the whole fuel filter thing was covered extensively in one huge thread.

Also about the points - the dizzy shaft (that spining thing inside the distributor with the rotor arm and metal plate on top) has at its base a cam with 4 corners - jack up the car put it in 4th and start spinning the front wheel, youl see the dizzy shaft spinning. Each time the contact heel for the points (that little angled thing that rubs against the shaft and from which a metal band runs to the points) sits right on the tip of an angle (lobe) on the shaft, your points should have the gap (0.4mm) between them. They should also be clean and move smouthly.
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