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Disc Brake Help
https://www.ausmini.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=21855		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  CPOCSM [ Fri Aug 25, 2006 1:17 pm ]
Post subject:  Disc Brake Help
Hi all - I need a little bit of help.

I have got all my hubs all ready to go and installed the bearings including the spacer. I have inserted the seals and the water seal on the CV and inserted into hub. I went to put the flange and disc assembly together over the splines and went to wang the castellated nut up and found that the disc is flush up against the face of the hub. I have removed the seals and reset them, tried lightly tapping the back of the CV with a rubber mallet and even tightened the nut to spec and still the hub is being fouled by the rotor.

Have I missed something here - do I have to install one of those retainers in the outer side. I am lost and about to throw the lot in the lake...lol

Any help appreciated...

Hooroo
Author:  Matt68 [ Fri Aug 25, 2006 2:17 pm ]
Post subject: 
Hi rob

Don't suppose you can send us a picture?

It sounds like the cv joint isn't going far enough through the drive flange. I am confused what you mean by water seal. is this the CV boot that goes over the end of the CV and driveshaft?

When I put mine together i had no issues with that clearance at all.

Are you building the assembly up on or off the car?

A good second chech is to put the caliper on the hub and see if the disc is centralised. If not, you know the CV joint just isn't going through far enough.

Did you drift the bearing shells in all the way? What thickness spacer did you use? New bearings I presume?

Cheers
matt
Author:  Lillee [ Fri Aug 25, 2006 2:34 pm ]
Post subject: 
Have you forgotten the tapered washer??
Author:  simon k [ Fri Aug 25, 2006 2:39 pm ]
Post subject: 
8.4" or 7.5" ?
Author:  CPOCSM [ Fri Aug 25, 2006 2:43 pm ]
Post subject: 
7.5 cooper S, the split washer is in and the little white plastic water thrower is on the CV joint. The whole assembly is off the car(crickey its hard to get it to 150ft/lb) and I am going to check I have the inner most bearings in far enough.

I may have to call on some of the brains trust here in Canberra over the week-end or go to Langes at Queanbeyan(he worked on coopers and minis for a long time in the '60's)

Keep the suggestions coming in if you can...more for me to look at ...lol

I am endebted

Edit - I will get some piccies for you when I get home(its great surfing AUSMINI at work!!)

Hooroo
Author:  simon k [ Fri Aug 25, 2006 2:50 pm ]
Post subject: 
well, the disk rotor is screwed to the drive flange, with the studs through it, so as long as the flange is seated into the rim on the outer face of the rotor, then that's OK

the drive flange then goes over the CV spline, and hard up against the end of the CV - so if they'll pull up hard against each other, then that's OK too

that's where Matt68's suggestion that the CV isn't going through far enough sounds right - is the inner bearing's outer race seated properly in the upright? - you'd expect it'd pull in when you torqued up the nut, but :?

take it all apart and assemble each bit on it's own - CV & drive flange together, CV & flange in the upright without the rotor etc.
Author:  Kinkabell [ Fri Aug 25, 2006 3:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Disc Brake Help
CPOCSM wrote:
Have I missed something here - do I have to install one of those retainers in the outer side. I am lost and about to throw the lot in the lake...lol

Any help appreciated...

Hooroo


Sorry cant help you much her Rob been too long since I played around with disk brakes :(..

But I did want to say if you do decide to throw the lot in the lake can you please throw it in my direction :)...
Author:  Lillee [ Fri Aug 25, 2006 3:29 pm ]
Post subject: 
That was going to be my other suggestion, is the drive flange seated far enough so that it is touching the disc, they can be slightly misaligned and not sit properly therefore there is a gap, thefore the disc sits further back and touches the hub
Author:  CPOCSM [ Fri Aug 25, 2006 3:42 pm ]
Post subject: 
Hmmm - that could be the problem as there is POR 15 paint on the lip iof the drive flange. I will go home and get the stanley knife out to remove it. Could give me enough clearance to get them to fit. I am going to do this via doing the other side and seeing if I get the same problem. :lol:

See how I go...thanks again...lol

Hooroo
Author:  1071 [ Fri Aug 25, 2006 3:56 pm ]
Post subject: 
Rob, two things to check...if the inner face of the drive flange is worn (through continued running on rooted bearings) the disc will sit further in and possibly foul on the steering arm. Also some (not quite the highest quality) discs don't have a big enough 'hole' for the drive flange to sit in properly. This will also force the disc to sit too far 'in' (so it fouls the upright - again generally on the steering arms). Solution to this is to chamfer the inner outer (still with me?? :) edge of the drive flange.

Cheers, Ian
Author:  Mike_Byron [ Fri Aug 25, 2006 4:35 pm ]
Post subject: 
Rob
I have never had any problems assembling disc brakes and bearings. However without going over what anybody eles has said. The inner and outer bearings are supplied as a kit with the spacer machined accurately to suit that kit. Is there anyway possible you could have interchanged the spacers ?????
Author:  64cooper [ Fri Aug 25, 2006 5:51 pm ]
Post subject:  disc brake problem
Rob
if you have a BMC workshop manual there is a cutout view of the front hub assembly. The position of the CV has little to do with your problem of the rotor rubbing as the bearing is what stops the flange/rotor assembly from fouling the hub. There are a few things that can cause it but the most likely is that the rotor has not been pulled up on the flange (hard to do). Been there done that. Next is what Ian (1071) has spoken of with wear on the inner bearing face of the flange. New flange is the only way to fix that. The next thing can be that there is an inner tapered collar (that was in use on earlier model "S" brakes), it may be missing.

Don't give up, keep going as it will be something quite simple. If you don't have the manual, I can scan and send the relevant info.

cheers
Author:  sports850 [ Fri Aug 25, 2006 6:42 pm ]
Post subject: 
Just as an idea , did you buy them as an assembled but used set or in pieces (discs off hubs mainly) , is it possible to check and see if they are a mixture of cooper and cooper s discs if you haven't had this particular set together before ? I can remember hearing something about the parts not being interchangeable (definitely not interchangeable) but could be assembled in some fashion and not possible to work as the spacings were way out . Just something to look at if they were in pieces .
Author:  CPOCSM [ Fri Aug 25, 2006 9:33 pm ]
Post subject: 
I dis-assembled the first assembly bar the outer bearing shells and wiped out the grease - both outer shells were home on the fixed middle spacer. Re-inserted the inner bearing race and seals. More grease(luckily the packets of grease are really sticky and managed to keep most of the grease intact)and the seals went back in - with the seals, do you press them in so they are FLUSH with the flange or right down on the bearings(I did the former...).

Then it dawned on me - I was twiddling with the counter sink screws on the rotor and drive flange and they were loose(I am sure I wanged them up tight with the impact driver!!). It was so simple - the POR paint was preventing the flange from sitting right down on the rotor(the por heats up with friction hence binding to the POR on the rotor...). A bastard file was found(this is tough paint!!) and CAREFULLY filed the paint away. Now there is no interference and the disc is centred in the calipers. Problem solved. I bolted them to a spare contessa and spun them with glee - no rubbing and all together(need torqueing and boots...)

I want to thank you all for your help - wouldnt have been able to do it without your help.

One more thing - I used 1 packet of the green creepy grease per side and there was grease all over the shop - is the contents of these grease packets enough for the bearings?? Just a thought....

Hooroo and thanks again...
Author:  Mike_Byron [ Fri Aug 25, 2006 9:39 pm ]
Post subject: 
There is a trick to greasing bearings

Get a dollop of grease - a generous dollop - in the palm of your hand. With the bearing in the other hand hit the bearing into the grease in in your hand while rotating the bearing. Do this until the bearing has an even coating all the way around. Doing it this way drives the grease all the way into the bearing.
Less grease is used and there is less mess too.
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