ausmini
https://www.ausmini.com/forums/

A few qustions about timing chains and extractors
https://www.ausmini.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=27527		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  Jaffas [ Wed Jan 31, 2007 11:50 pm ]
Post subject:  A few qustions about timing chains and extractors
Hi all, while trying to find the exhaust leak that chokes us while driving I decided to check the extractor bolts and found that every one of them was loose! I gave them all a good snug except for this one (800x600 90kb image). The bolt on the right is kissing the extractor pipe and there is not room for a socket, wrench or spanner. There appears to have been some previous efforts at tightening it. Any guess on how I can tighten this?

We are changing the timing chain as it sounds like a can of rocks. I've read about the Duplex chain and how it "need to countersink the 2 lower screw holes in the engine front plate". So I'm going to put on a simplex. Any recommendation on where to get one?

Also, does the radiator really need these rubber things? Image

Thanks for the help,
Marty & Manda
Author:  Mick [ Thu Feb 01, 2007 6:10 am ]
Post subject: 
1. The extractor situation happen regularly enough and would be one of the more annoying things to happen when trying to fit or remove extractors with the exception of the bottom bolt stripping maybe. You could try gently sliding the extractor over a little after loosening the nuts on that arm, they will move a little, and then tighten one down to keep it there while you do the last one up. I would maybe try and switch the nut out if you can to prevent it rounding off more.

2. The fact it is simplex is the reason you are there in the first place. They are pretty well known for the racket they make. Have a think about going duplex because countersinking is really quite simple to do with a drill and bits, but you would need to unbolt the plate from the engine to do so. There are only a couple that need to be done. Duplex kits are easily available and once they are fitted you will not need to bother with it for a very very long time. Otherwise simplex chains are cheap and easy to get on eBay or through the usual mini businesses.

3. Yes or you will go nuts with noise and vibration, but these are the wrong ones. The right ones are grommets that sit into the bracket and isolate the bolt from touching the steel radiator bracket. They can be found at supercheap if you know what they look like, or from the same mini place you got the timing chain from.
Author:  1310/71 [ Thu Feb 01, 2007 6:52 am ]
Post subject: 
re the extractor nut. I went to a local specialist tool shop and bought a Stahlwillie spanner of the appropriate size (ring/open ender). I normally use Sidchrome and found them too big and chunky to fit. The stahlwillie is a bit slimmer and better able to get into those tight spots, although looking at that photo, I think I've got more clearance than you.

But yeah, it is one of those non-favoured jobs on a mini - we've all got cut-off and ground down "special tools" for jobs like that.
KB
Author:  Spaceboy [ Thu Feb 01, 2007 12:21 pm ]
Post subject: 
yeah replacing a single timing chain is a waste of time, its duplex or nothing.
Author:  Lillee [ Thu Feb 01, 2007 4:23 pm ]
Post subject: 
Hold on... How do you know space boy??? have you done it?

I have and it's not a waste of time. It's not an easy job but I can think of many worste ones. It is a CHEAP job at $10 for a cheap chain... so you can't compare it to spending $100's on a double row kit and chain.

Countersinking it in situ with engine in will produce alot of swarf and metal shavings, and you will need to do it with a timing light as the new cogs will be totally out of alignment.

Replacing the chain is by far the easiest option. you need new chain, timing cover gasket, timing cover oil seal (you may as well), a torch, a white pen marker to mark the cogs before pulling them out and perhaps a bearing puller of somesort to get the cogs off the cam/crank.

Once done it will last you several 1000 miles before it stretches again, but so will double chain...

Once changed, they make no noise. Same as a double but double lasts twice as long before stretching.

If you have deep pockets, do it! In fact go buy a belt drive
Author:  Spaceboy [ Thu Feb 01, 2007 4:31 pm ]
Post subject: 
$100's of dollars? wtf

ask any mini mechanic
Author:  Lillee [ Thu Feb 01, 2007 4:35 pm ]
Post subject: 
righto, go find a mechanic that will give you a double row chain and put it infor you for under $200

Pete's rollmaster parts only cost $170 from a pretty cheap source. That is without a german chain and no vernier.

At $75 per hour average mechanic charge out rate, I am guessing it will take at least 2 hours if he is of "grieg malure" or "kevin green" skills...
Author:  Wombat [ Thu Feb 01, 2007 5:02 pm ]
Post subject: 
I agree with Lillee - not much change out of $200 if a mechanic does it
Author:  Spaceboy [ Thu Feb 01, 2007 5:08 pm ]
Post subject: 
still gotta do the same thing to fit a single row, its a waste of money..
it will never be good unless you fit a duplex
Author:  graham in aus [ Thu Feb 01, 2007 5:08 pm ]
Post subject: 
On the "Being gassed by exhaust issue" there are some wierd things that can happen with the windows open, does your exhaust tip end still under the car, i.e. not sticking out past the rear beaver panel?

I've found (admitedly with a sliding window car) that it is possible to suck fumes from the back into the car, kind of a vacuum effect. I believe this is also common with vans too when the rear doors dont fit too well.

Some kind of issue with negative pressure behind the 'Brick' !! :lol:
Author:  Morris 1100 [ Thu Feb 01, 2007 6:41 pm ]
Post subject: 
The boot seal is another place that exhaust fumes can get sucked into the car.

The single row timing chain in my 1100 is still running fine after 40 years. 8) So how long would a duplex last under the same conditions? :?
Author:  drmini in aust [ Thu Feb 01, 2007 6:46 pm ]
Post subject: 
Lillee wrote:
Pete's rollmaster parts only cost $170 from a pretty cheap source. That is without a german chain and no vernier.

Chong, the Rollmaster kit includes a German `Jwis' duplex chain, and it IS a vernier setup, there are multiple keyways in the crank sprocket to allow 2* steps. :wink:
And, it didn't cost him $170.... 8)
Author:  Mick [ Thu Feb 01, 2007 7:00 pm ]
Post subject: 
Yeah sure, a simplex chain is cheap and if you're not worried about the long term then fine. It doesn't take very much before they make noise again though...

If you're there allready, the duplex kits are pretty cheap, not ten bucks though, prolly more than 130 locally. I got one from Minispares UK incl. post for 75 last time I had to, not the uber-performance item, but neither is a simplex. At least it's quiet. Also needs an extra gasket than usual for the plate. I paid a dollar.

Make your choice based on the extra cost and whether you want to do the little extra work. Lining the dots up on the timing wheels is very important, and they are known to not be exactly correctly marked all the time (by somewhere up to 7 degrees), but neither will the original wheels. Throw in a stretched chain and what's the point? I reckon at 200 dollars including parts, a mechanic won't be timing it in either.....time is money and all that..
Author:  Lillee [ Thu Feb 01, 2007 7:46 pm ]
Post subject: 
drmini in aust wrote:
And, it didn't cost him $170.... 8)


Rollmaster kit he got was $125 plus $10 postage. What's $35 among friends?
Author:  64cooper [ Thu Feb 01, 2007 7:51 pm ]
Post subject:  timing chain
Just replacing the simplex chain will not necessarily cure the noise as the timing chain tensioner rings can also be a problem as well as worn sprockets. If it is to be replaced, go with a duplex straight off.
Page 1 of 2 All times are UTC + 10 hours
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group
http://www.phpbb.com/