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Damn it! buying an Arc Welder https://www.ausmini.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=57522	Page 1 of 3

Author:	marc2131 [ Thu Oct 01, 2009 11:48 am ]
Post subject:	Damn it! buying an Arc Welder
I just came across quite a large rust hole in the driver side foot well area of my deluxe. Not sure if it is structural, doesnt look like it is. It is located just inside of the A panel below the boot door hinge, right at the bottom. I need to get the bottom of the battery box welded too. If I bought a cheap Arc Welder, would one of those cheap $150 ones be sufficient for the job? What if I wanted to do bigger jobs in the future, like make a table etc. Would this still work. I was told it would only deal with steel between 2 to 6mm in thickness. How many amps should I go up to?

Author:	adzzza [ Thu Oct 01, 2009 11:55 am ]
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I don't know half as much about welding as most on here, but you can forget Ark welding. At a minimum I have been advised to look at MIG. And as for the cheap jobs, you get what you pay for. A good welder can cost thousands, so you can only wonder how bad a $400 job off ebay will perform! Good luck.

Author:	miniron [ Thu Oct 01, 2009 12:02 pm ]
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Mini body panels are made of steel approx 0.040"/1mm thick in this area. To weld steel this thin you need either oxy/acetylene gas equipment or a MIG welder. Unless you are a very experienced welder its very difficult to plain arc weld steel this thin. How do I know?????? Using oxy/acetylene you will need almost the smallest tip size, No6 tip 0.6mm, to successfully gas weld steel this thin. If you fit the repair section up properly with virtually no gap you can fuse the edges together without using any filler rod. It also takes some practice and the equipment is not cheap. I don't have any experience with MIG welding but body repair shops use this extensively. Hope this gives you a start RonR

Author:	Phat Kat [ Thu Oct 01, 2009 12:08 pm ]
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[quote="adzzza"]I don't know half as much about welding as most on here, but you can forget Ark welding. At a minimum I have been advised to look at MIG. And as for the cheap jobs, you get what you pay for. A good welder can cost thousands, so you can only wonder how bad a $400 job off ebay will perform! Good luck.[/quote] What he said. I have gotten away with an ark welder in a totlal pinch, but I am an experienced welder and I found it a challenge, its to hot... who knows you might be a natural and proove me totally wrong .... You know what actually, often you find cheap MIG welders at cash conveters and those sought of places. Again, I don't use MIG personally, I prefer Oxy for body work, but there can be a bit of a nack to getting the hang of Oxy and it can be hard to teach yourself to do it PROPERLY. MIG is a bit more forgiving. Woop you snuck up on me there Ron. Your totally right, a number 6 or 8 tip for oxy and panel shops usually use MIG because its quicker for them to weld in grind it and bog it. I do file finishes as much as possible so I hate MIG with a vengence, the weld is always harder than the parent material which means that its easy to file off more of the parent material than the weld, the other thing is that it is hard to do any forming after you've MIGed something, oxy is nicer because a good fussion weld (like the one you described) is like having no weld at all so it behaves like one consistant material when you beat it.

Author:	drmini in aust [ Thu Oct 01, 2009 1:47 pm ]
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I still have a big old arc welder, I have to say it hasn't been used for years. 2.0mm steel is about the thinnest that arc is any good for. 1.6mm at a pinch. I have oxy too, but for panel repairs I find it puts too much heat in and gives distortion. I'm a welder, not a panelbeater... MIG for me. You don't need a big one, just a reliable brand that will run good at low current. Mine is a Kemppi 125A (ex panel shop). Voltage control is stepless. <edit> It runs well with 0.8 solid wire and Argoshield Light (aka 50) gas. I tried 0.6 wire, but found 0.8 better on this machine. It welds good from 30A up (yep it has an ammeter) I use gasless on site fabrication jobs at work, but IMO solid wire and gas works best on thin stuff, like body panels.

Author:	pigsfly [ Thu Oct 01, 2009 1:51 pm ]
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Quite seriously do not even bother with a cheap ARC welder... They will make the hole bigger and bigger and then you'll get the shits and get someone else to do it which will cost you more money. Save your pennies and buy a MIG. Much better control for someone not used to welding and very easy to use... If you use gas you wont get the slag/splatter issues you will have with gasless or ARC.

Author:	marc2131 [ Thu Oct 01, 2009 2:23 pm ]
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I know i have to be careful with the bottom end of the MIG market, but when you have little spare cash ...... Would appreciate some comments on this offering on ebay: http://cgi.ebay.com.au/NEW-130AMP-GAS-A ... 286.c0.m14

Author:	Phat Kat [ Thu Oct 01, 2009 2:52 pm ]
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marc if your on a budget, I hate to say it (more for your sake) but Oxy is cheaper, for the price of a bad MIG welder you'll get a pretty reasonable oxy kit and the bottle hire only costs me $12 a month. So I hate to say it because like I said, and then the doc said, and then every man and his dog said, MIG is easier to teach yourself and more forgiving If you have little experience... Oxy is good once you can do it well but there is a nack to it. I have friends who are boiler makers and special class welders who can't oxy weld thin sheet to save themselves... They don't know how to provide relief for the stress thats the only clue I'm giving away. (well before I get a panel beating how to/sticky going)

Author:	drmini in aust [ Thu Oct 01, 2009 3:05 pm ]
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marc2131 wrote: Would appreciate some comments on this offering on ebay: http://cgi.ebay.com.au/NEW-130AMP-GAS-A ... 286.c0.m14 The guys selling it don't know how a MIG works. There are not 4 amp settings, there are 4 Voltage settings. 4 is just not enough... but it's what you get at the bottom end of the market At least this one has a wire speed (Amps) control. A member here bought a cheapo gasless, it had no wire speed control and only 2 voltage settings. Bloody toy... Another problem with real cheapos, they don't have a contactor on the transformer when you squeeze the trigger- it is live all the time. And therefore so is the contact tip & welding wire..

Author:	MG Rocket [ Thu Oct 01, 2009 3:23 pm ]
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When I was in bind once, I cleaned up everything with a grinder and Sikaflexed an over sized homemade panel (6"X4" rust hole in rear quarter panel and also behind each wheel arch) and then bogged it up. I was absolutely seriously bust at the time. But the repairs stayed there for about 3 years before it got carted off to Sims. I was very proud of my quarter panel, if it wasn't for the mismatch with the spray can you couldn't tell.

Author:	mini maxx [ Thu Oct 01, 2009 3:37 pm ]
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MIG....... just make sure its a goodun

Author:	blue_deluxe [ Thu Oct 01, 2009 4:28 pm ]
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What do people think of tig welding? Ive heard its more expensive to start off and trickier to do. But otherwise similar to mig. Im looking at doing a welding course soon, and figured instead of buying a decent mig then spending again on a tig, i could just learn on a tig. What do people think?

Author:	drmini in aust [ Thu Oct 01, 2009 4:38 pm ]
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IMO TIG is great on panels, if fitup good and no rust. Otherwise gimme a MIG... TIG inverters are getting cheap, but if buying one I'd get with HF start, not scratch or lift start. I love the look and price of this one, and the good duty cycle... http://www.weldsmart.com.au/welding-aus ... ter-welder Not for aluminium welding though, you would need an AC/DC one with HF.

Author:	Wombat [ Thu Oct 01, 2009 4:47 pm ]
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drmini in aust wrote: IMO TIG is great on panels, if fitup good and no rust. Otherwise gimme a MIG... TIG inverters are getting cheap, but if buying one I'd get with HF start, not scratch or lift start. I love the look and price of this one, and the good duty cycle... http://www.weldsmart.com.au/welding-aus ... ter-welder Not for aluminium welding though, you would need an AC/DC one with HF. That's about what I paid for my MIG

Author:	WantOne [ Thu Oct 01, 2009 5:42 pm ]
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I'm buying my MIG tomorrow arvo. I been checking them out for the last two weeks and I've decided on one from the BOC shop for about $1300 with a bottle of hired argon light. I've never welded before but I'm guessing this will do the trick for learning. (MAGMATE 180)

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