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| Time taken to do wheel alignment https://www.ausmini.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=58490 |
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| Author: | dannzhu [ Wed Nov 04, 2009 1:50 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Time taken to do wheel alignment |
Hi everyone, Last time I took my car (has adjustable geometry components) for wheel alignment at a tyre shop, we didn't realise it took almost 2 hours to get (almost get!) the settings that I wanted. As a result, the process was finished in a hurry and the car was moved to make way for the other waiting customers. So what's the average time to do a wheel alignment on a mini? Is there any way to make the process faster? And which one would you do first, and any things to watch out for? Thanks, Daniel |
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| Author: | sgc [ Wed Nov 04, 2009 1:55 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Mine took easily that long both times I had it done recently. The order of settings should be: 1. Ride height 2. Camber 3. Toe 4. Caster Be aware that tightening up the caster bar bushes itself alters the caster, so this one can be a bit fiddly to get spot on. |
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| Author: | dannzhu [ Wed Nov 04, 2009 2:22 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Hmmm...when the tyre shop did mine, they did the caster first, then camber, toe being the last. Then they had to go back and adjust the other area again. What boggles me is when they did the rear toe-in. They couldn't even get it to the before setting because the plate on the rear camber bracket is already at the max forward. Can you please confirm if my understanding is correct based on the order you mentioned? 1. When setting camber, it affects caster, but caster setting doesn't affect camber? 2. When toe is set, it affects caster? And caster doesn't affect toe? Thanks, Daniel |
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| Author: | Fat Boy Dave [ Wed Nov 04, 2009 2:36 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Mine took at least 45 minutes and was proably closer to an hour... I suspect was at the same place as SGC. Although I don't think my car had as many alignement issues as Simon's had. |
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| Author: | sgc [ Wed Nov 04, 2009 2:42 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Fat Boy Dave wrote: Although I don't think my car had as many alignement issues as Simon's had.
Dave, what are you trying to say!? 
You're right though, my front subframe has been hit some time in the past and isn't very square.. without the adjustable kit the car is all over the place and will fire you into the bushes sooner than look at you. I was surprised with the rear end too, the toe on one side was 4mm OUT 
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| Author: | GT mowog [ Wed Nov 04, 2009 3:42 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
dannzhu wrote: Can you please confirm if my understanding is correct based on the order you mentioned? 1. When setting camber, it affects caster, but caster setting doesn't affect camber? 2. When toe is set, it affects caster? And caster doesn't affect toe? Thanks, Daniel Daniel, yes, adjusting the camber will have an effect on the caster adjustment and likewise caster will have a (small) effect on camber, so it would be normal to go back and forth a bit between these two adjustments. Think of the Control Arm, the Radius (or Caster) Arm and your sub-frame as a triangle and you will soon see that by lengthing or shortening on side of the triangle will effect the location of the Lower arm / Radius Arm junction. Depending on the type of adjustable caster arms that you have some will also require 'fine tuning' on tightening up on the bushes, but there are other types that adjust elsewhere, so you can tighten the bushes before you start..... Toe adjustement would normally be done last (but should be roughly close to start with) and should not have any effect or be effected by the other adjustements. |
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| Author: | TheMiniMan [ Wed Nov 04, 2009 4:24 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Yeah GT has it right,,, what i do is set the ride heights first, set the toe close enough to start, then effectively "jiggle" between camber & caster to get both sides fairly square & then set the toe,,, BUT,,, then have a good look at the ride heights agin & if they`re a bit funny still, then we go through the whole process again, basically just neatening it all up Bit by bit is the way to go,,, make any large adjustemtn to one of them & you have just made a large eroor on the other If you set the ride heights where you want them,,, but then go & set a whole bag full of neg camber (setting up the caster as you go) then have another look at the ride heights,,, HHhmmmm,,,, they`re suddenly not where you left them either hey??? 
& yes 2 hours is pretty std isuue with adjustables,,, But if they`ve been there for 5 million years & never had any grease on them in the first place,,, weellllllllllllll take your sleeping bag & toothbrush
The rears don`t have to have "adjustable brackets" to be able to adjust them,,, you can set it all up on the machine, find out where they`re pointing,, then remove the rear trailing arm bracket & die-grind the hole oval , or triangular, in the direction you need them to go,,, re-fit & jiggle the pin to where you want it --->(up to a point) if you add a big flat washer behind the nut then when it`s all set & tightened it will stay there,,, if you have any concerns about them comming loose then a small tack or stitch weld on the washer will keep them stable for ever & yes the rear takes another chunk of your day , especially if there is dramas with the bracket bolts & threads being stripped or previously cross threaded , or simply rusted solid
easy-peasy & good to see you here with more quality info/help GT
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| Author: | Wombat [ Wed Nov 04, 2009 4:28 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
When you are talking about 'setting ride height' is that only refering to Hi-Lows or can you adjust ride height with rubber cones? |
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| Author: | TheMiniMan [ Wed Nov 04, 2009 4:35 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
fitting hi-los is the easiest option,,, if you don`t have hi-los fitted (or similar type of adjustable struts) then you can only adjust the ride heights by adding washers between the strut & the kuckle joint, (raising) ,,,, or grinding metal off from the bottom of the strut (lowering),,, now,,, to achieve that, then you have to remove the strut , add washer or grind meat off,,,, then re-fit each time you try to adjust the heights... sorry but those days are gone for me... fit Hi-los or go home
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| Author: | 850 GT [ Wed Nov 04, 2009 6:27 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
I like the way you think Fit hi.los or go home! |
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| Author: | drmini in aust [ Wed Nov 04, 2009 6:33 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
After 40 years or more of driving, minor accidents etc, the rear subframes' geometry of most Minis is all over the place....
The rear arms have provision for shims to be fitted behind the outer bracket, but all these can do is reduce the toe-in. If one side or both are toed-OUT (without shims) to start with, Houston... we have a problem. As Matt said, the hole can be moved, no problem. I set the bracket up in the mill, and slot the hole forward with a 1/2" slot drill. Then I MIG weld the back of the hole, and put the slot drill through it again. It makes a neat job with no washers needed. I did 4myego's S the other day, from his prior wheel `alignment' the RH side was toed out 3.2mm. After doing some calcs I moved the hole forward 2.7mm and fitted a 0.45mm galvabond shim. For each 1 degree change in toe (or camber for that matter,) = move the hole 4.0mm (almost exactly). |
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| Author: | Morris 1100 [ Wed Nov 04, 2009 6:35 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
My theory when I was doing my own wheel alignments was they take as long as it takes. It does not matter if it is a Mini or a twin steer truck. You don't take shortcuts and it has to be right. So don't look at the clock till the job is over. It is not hard to do your own wheel alignment but you have to know what you are doing and why you are doing it. |
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| Author: | GT mowog [ Wed Nov 04, 2009 7:39 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
TheMiniMan wrote: easy-peasy Ha
Maybe, but lots of patience. It's real easy to keep going round in circles - just like the speedway hey! Ta Matt for the finishing touches.......... |
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| Author: | GT mowog [ Wed Nov 04, 2009 7:42 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Morris 1100 wrote: My theory when I was doing my own wheel alignments was they take as long as it takes. It does not matter if it is a Mini or a twin steer truck. You don't take shortcuts and it has to be right.
So don't look at the clock till the job is over. It is not hard to do your own wheel alignment but you have to know what you are doing and why you are doing it. Yeap and Yeap |
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| Author: | dannzhu [ Wed Nov 04, 2009 8:40 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
GT mowog wrote: Toe adjustement would normally be done last (but should be roughly close to start with) and should not have any effect or be effected by the other adjustements.
However it did on mine. The guy set up the toe last, then found out it changed the camber and caster as well. So from what you said, as long as it was close to start with, it shouldn't affect the others? If I may summarise what everyone said, the order is: 1. Ride height 2. Toe (make sure it's close to what you want) 3. Camber 4. Caster 5. Bit by bit adjustment of camber & caster 6. Toe With the toe settings, when people say 1/16inch toe, is that supposed to be for each side or is it the difference in distance between front side and back side of both front tyres? And is it bad to the components if you run only 2deg caster? Thanks, Daniel |
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