ausmini :: View topic - Mystery numbers on Cooper S rad. cowl.

the car number on the firewall should be the same as the ID plate.
the number on radiator cowl is the body number which should be approx 500 different than the car number.
So the numbers on your car are correct
Rgds Felix

In issue 1 of the mini experience, watto states that the body number in the radiator cowl should be approximately 500 before the car number, which means yours is correct. The other numbers stamped at 90 degrees to the body number also sound correct. In the mag, he mentions the other numbers as the factory production codes, but does not say that the model YKG2S2 should be there too....

I know on my car the production codes are stamped very lightly, very hard to make them out, even with the paint rubbed back...

The radiator cowling should have the car no stamped on it eg:1234 as well as
this combination on the radiator cowling which should be
M2
06
and read like this
as this combination is the Cooper S production code
these are small and can be lightly stamped

I have seen cars upto 13 numbers different from the 500 variations this being higher and lower.
Mark 1 Cooper S radiator cowlings should have only 3 or 4 digits stamped on them due to production numbers + M2 at a right angle to these numbers.
06
Yours sounds correct just check that is a 6 not a 5 over the M

Sorry I meant 6 over the 2
M2
06
these can be hard to read

Number86 wrote:

...well thanks guys, thats sounding very encouraging.

It's strange though, I'm 100% certain that apart from the 4291 and the 90 degree 2 over 5 there are no other stampings, I have not rubbed with emery only carefully used stripper and thinners. The area where I expected prod codes to be appeared to be covered the original enamal and a grey primer (and they were hard to remove) and the steel underneath is a perfect flat matt finish, just like it would looked at the factory before painting.

but here's my next problem.....

lets say the only codes/numbers on the cowl are 4291 (apart from the sideways 2over5)

So what should be on the NSW rego papers as the chassis no.??

unfortunately the current interstate papers say "NOT RECORDED" so that's no help.

phillb wrote:

Number86 wrote:

The numbers on the rego papers should be those on the ID plate and on the firewall.
The problem is that as you say, inspectors are used to recording those on the radiator shroud, as these were used on all Minis from 1969 onwards.
I would take a copy of TME Vol 1 with you when you front up for the blueslip inspection.
Query him on this BEFORE he writes anything up.
If you get grief, vote with your feet and find another blueslip inspector, as I did once. :wink:

In that case I would go to the RTA identity check, but take a copy of TME #1 (or a photocopy) with you.
They should be understanding...

drmini in aust wrote:

In that case I would go to the RTA identity check, but take a copy of TME #1 (or a photocopy) with you.
They should be understanding...

Sorry Doc, I'd actually suggest taking the Leyland Workshop Manual rather than a Magazine (sorry Craig), reason being that TME is only a Magazine (- no disrespect Craig ) but the Workshop Manual is an official factory publication.

Author:	phillb [ Sun Nov 08, 2009 12:42 pm ]
Post subject:	Mystery numbers on Cooper S rad. cowl.
I have a (late?) 1968 Cooper S. There is no doubt it is a genuine Mk1 S. The Type and Car No. on the ID plate on the firewall behind the master cylinders is YKG2S2 48xx. The same number, 48xx, is stamped into the body just below the plate. There were several layers of paint over this number and it was hard to read until I removed the paint. The Radiator cowl had a lot of paint too and no numbers could be seen. Because the car is being rego'ed into NSW from interstate the inspector for the blue slip was unhappy about there being no readable chassis number on the Rad. cowl (he was familiar with Minis having chassis numbers there). He wants me to take the car to RTA to get a identity check and he thought I may need to be issued with a new chassis number. I'm hoping the RTA will accept YKG2S2 48xx because the correct matching number is stamped in the car firewall. Not only that but the engine no. and paint details match the car. Anyhow, I was hesitant to rub back the paint of the Rad cowl as I might uncover some other cars Chassis No. due to perhaps that section being replaced after an accident. Eventually the suspense was killing me so I took the paint off the top of the Rad. cowl with thinners and here's what I found. A four digit stamped number right in the middle of the Radiator cowl. 429x The number is read from the engine side and appears to be one stamp as the 4 numbers are very consistant in depth, perfectly spaced and neatly in line with each other (or the stamper was very anal) and they seem to be right in the centre of the shroud. They are also parallel to the edge that attaches to the inner guard. They are about 7mm tall, therefore smaller than the ones on the firewall but a similar font. The only other numbers are a 2 and a 5 that are above one another like this... 2 5 but these are smaller than the other numbers, slightly to the right and they lie sideways. They are right way up if viewed standing at the front of the car. There are no other numbers or letters, I've taken most of the paint away (esp. to the left of the numbers where I expected to find YKG2S2 or some other model prefix) but there's simply nothing else there. And there doesn't seem to be any other paint colour layers (ie from another car) I was also expecting any number to be approx 500 more than 48xx, however this number is 510 less (coincidence??) I was thinking it was just some sort of part number for a new replacement guard or shroud?? Any suggestions?? Thanks in advance.

Author:	1970cooper [ Sun Nov 08, 2009 12:58 pm ]
Post subject:
the car number on the firewall should be the same as the ID plate. the number on radiator cowl is the body number which should be approx 500 different than the car number. So the numbers on your car are correct Rgds Felix

Author:	phillb [ Sun Nov 08, 2009 1:07 pm ]
Post subject:
1970cooper wrote: the car number on the firewall should be the same as the ID plate. the number on radiator cowl is the body number which should be approx 500 different than the car number. So the numbers on your car are correct Rgds Felix ...but I was expecting, from my reading of other posts and seeing other minis, that: a) There would be more on the cowl than just 4 digits ie it would be preceded by the YKG2S2 b) The number on the cowl to be approx 500 more not less. also I've never heard of this sideways 2above the 5??

Author:	Number86 [ Sun Nov 08, 2009 1:35 pm ]
Post subject:
In issue 1 of the mini experience, watto states that the body number in the radiator cowl should be approximately 500 before the car number, which means yours is correct. The other numbers stamped at 90 degrees to the body number also sound correct. In the mag, he mentions the other numbers as the factory production codes, but does not say that the model YKG2S2 should be there too.... I know on my car the production codes are stamped very lightly, very hard to make them out, even with the paint rubbed back...

Author:	Gezo [ Sun Nov 08, 2009 2:05 pm ]
Post subject:
The radiator cowling should have the car no stamped on it eg:1234 as well as this combination on the radiator cowling which should be M2 06 and read like this as this combination is the Cooper S production code these are small and can be lightly stamped I have seen cars upto 13 numbers different from the 500 variations this being higher and lower. Mark 1 Cooper S radiator cowlings should have only 3 or 4 digits stamped on them due to production numbers + M2 at a right angle to these numbers. 06 Yours sounds correct just check that is a 6 not a 5 over the M

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Author:	phillb [ Sun Nov 08, 2009 2:06 pm ]
Post subject:
Number86 wrote: In issue 1 of the mini experience, watto states that the body number in the radiator cowl should be approximately 500 before the car number, which means yours is correct. The other numbers stamped at 90 degrees to the body number also sound correct. In the mag, he mentions the other numbers as the factory production codes, but does not say that the model YKG2S2 should be there too.... I know on my car the production codes are stamped very lightly, very hard to make them out, even with the paint rubbed back... ...well thanks guys, thats sounding very encouraging. It's strange though, I'm 100% certain that apart from the 429x and the 90 degree 2 over 5 there are no other stampings, I have not rubbed with emery only carefully used stripper and thinners. The area where I expected prod codes to be appeared to be covered the original enamal and a grey primer (and they were hard to remove) and the steel underneath is a perfect flat matt finish, just like it would looked at the factory before painting. but here's my next problem..... lets say the only codes/numbers on the cowl are 429x (apart from the sideways 2over5) So what should be on the NSW rego papers as the chassis no.?? unfortunately the current interstate papers say "NOT RECORDED" so that's no help.

Author:	phillb [ Sun Nov 08, 2009 2:08 pm ]
Post subject:
Gezo wrote: The radiator cowling should have the car no stamped on it eg:1234 as well as this combination on the radiator cowling which should be M2 06 and read like this as this combination is the Cooper S production code these are small and can be lightly stamped I have seen cars upto 13 numbers different from the 500 variations this being higher and lower. Mark 1 Cooper S radiator cowlings should have only 3 or 4 digits stamped on them due to production numbers + M2 at a right angle to these numbers. 06 Yours sounds correct just check that is a 6 not a 5 over the M Ok I'll take another look and try and get a photo up.

Author:	Gezo [ Sun Nov 08, 2009 2:08 pm ]
Post subject:
Sorry I meant 6 over the 2 M2 06 these can be hard to read

Author:	phillb [ Sun Nov 08, 2009 2:23 pm ]
Post subject:
Gezo wrote: Sorry I meant 6 over the 2 M2 06 these can be hard to read Ok. Thanks, I've taken a closer look. maybe its 2 6 and maybe the M 0 part is too light to see, also someone has rubbed through to the metal at that particular spot.

Author:	drmini in aust [ Sun Nov 08, 2009 6:39 pm ]
Post subject:
phillb wrote: Number86 wrote: In issue 1 of the mini experience, watto states that the body number in the radiator cowl should be approximately 500 before the car number, which means yours is correct. The other numbers stamped at 90 degrees to the body number also sound correct. In the mag, he mentions the other numbers as the factory production codes, but does not say that the model YKG2S2 should be there too.... I know on my car the production codes are stamped very lightly, very hard to make them out, even with the paint rubbed back... ...well thanks guys, thats sounding very encouraging. It's strange though, I'm 100% certain that apart from the 4291 and the 90 degree 2 over 5 there are no other stampings, I have not rubbed with emery only carefully used stripper and thinners. The area where I expected prod codes to be appeared to be covered the original enamal and a grey primer (and they were hard to remove) and the steel underneath is a perfect flat matt finish, just like it would looked at the factory before painting. but here's my next problem..... lets say the only codes/numbers on the cowl are 4291 (apart from the sideways 2over5) So what should be on the NSW rego papers as the chassis no.?? unfortunately the current interstate papers say "NOT RECORDED" so that's no help. The numbers on the rego papers should be those on the ID plate and on the firewall. The problem is that as you say, inspectors are used to recording those on the radiator shroud, as these were used on all Minis from 1969 onwards. I would take a copy of TME Vol 1 with you when you front up for the blueslip inspection. Query him on this BEFORE he writes anything up. If you get grief, vote with your feet and find another blueslip inspector, as I did once.

Author:	Number86 [ Sun Nov 08, 2009 7:56 pm ]
Post subject:
I agree with Dr Mini, you don't want someone messing with your car's numbers!

Author:	phillb [ Sun Nov 08, 2009 8:05 pm ]
Post subject:
drmini in aust wrote: phillb wrote: Number86 wrote: In issue 1 of the mini experience, watto states that the body number in the radiator cowl should be approximately 500 before the car number, which means yours is correct. The other numbers stamped at 90 degrees to the body number also sound correct. In the mag, he mentions the other numbers as the factory production codes, but does not say that the model YKG2S2 should be there too.... I know on my car the production codes are stamped very lightly, very hard to make them out, even with the paint rubbed back... ...well thanks guys, thats sounding very encouraging. It's strange though, I'm 100% certain that apart from the 4291 and the 90 degree 2 over 5 there are no other stampings, I have not rubbed with emery only carefully used stripper and thinners. The area where I expected prod codes to be appeared to be covered the original enamal and a grey primer (and they were hard to remove) and the steel underneath is a perfect flat matt finish, just like it would looked at the factory before painting. but here's my next problem..... lets say the only codes/numbers on the cowl are 4291 (apart from the sideways 2over5) So what should be on the NSW rego papers as the chassis no.?? unfortunately the current interstate papers say "NOT RECORDED" so that's no help. The numbers on the rego papers should be those on the ID plate and on the firewall. The problem is that as you say, inspectors are used to recording those on the radiator shroud, as these were used on all Minis from 1969 onwards. I would take a copy of TME Vol 1 with you when you front up for the blueslip inspection. Query him on this BEFORE he writes anything up. If you get grief, vote with your feet and find another blueslip inspector, as I did once. Unfortunately I have had the inspection already. In fact I had the inspection prior to cleaning away the cowl and exposing the numbers. In other word's the inspection prompted me to expose the cowl numbers, ...I was expecting him to go with the firewall number. The inspector wrote up the report and told me to book an appt. at RTA to have the car inspected, the papers are stamped "issued subject to RTA identity check" so I guess I could either... a) go back, see the inspector and see if he can reverse his decision (doubtful, probably too late) or b) go and have the identity check at the RTA and hope I can convince them to accept the ID plate number. I'll try and get a back issue of TME 1 in the meantime or if anyone can point me to any other web addresses or articles that discuss this issue of the correct numbers to use that would be very helpful.

Author:	drmini in aust [ Sun Nov 08, 2009 8:47 pm ]
Post subject:
In that case I would go to the RTA identity check, but take a copy of TME #1 (or a photocopy) with you. They should be understanding...

Author:	GT mowog [ Mon Nov 09, 2009 4:34 pm ]
Post subject:
drmini in aust wrote: In that case I would go to the RTA identity check, but take a copy of TME #1 (or a photocopy) with you. They should be understanding... Sorry Doc, I'd actually suggest taking the Leyland Workshop Manual rather than a Magazine (sorry Craig), reason being that TME is only a Magazine (- no disrespect Craig ) but the Workshop Manual is an official factory publication.

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Author:	Morris 1100 [ Mon Nov 09, 2009 4:50 pm ]
Post subject:
GT mowog wrote: drmini in aust wrote: In that case I would go to the RTA identity check, but take a copy of TME #1 (or a photocopy) with you. They should be understanding... Sorry Doc, I'd actually suggest taking the Leyland Workshop Manual rather than a Magazine (sorry Craig), reason being that TME is only a Magazine (- no disrespect Craig ) but the Workshop Manual is an official factory publication. The factory workshop manual may be an official factory publication but it does not say that the car number is stamped on the firewall. It says that the ID plate is on the firewall and that during 69 they changed the location of the stamping to the engine radiator cowl but it does not say where it was moved from.