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another Brakes question
https://www.ausmini.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=59980		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  Leighton [ Sun Jan 03, 2010 10:05 pm ]
Post subject:  another Brakes question
I have been trying to bleed my brakes for a few weeks now, after finding and rectifying the leaks, i figured that it should be a relitavely simple task...how wrong i was...

i have gone through about 8 bottles of fluid and i can not get a steady solid pedal. i can pump it up and it will stay solid for a few moments then just goes to sh1t.

i have tried several different methods of brake bleeding and i still can not get a strong pedal.

what have i done wrong?

can anyone give me some advice on what to do?

thankyou,

Leighton
Author:  superSeven [ Sun Jan 03, 2010 10:09 pm ]
Post subject: 
discs? drums?
master cylinder condition?
Author:  Leighton [ Sun Jan 03, 2010 10:14 pm ]
Post subject: 
sorry,

its rolling drums,

the master cylinder is pretty well in an unknown condition, the resiviour was clean though when it went back in.
Author:  Tombo [ Sun Jan 03, 2010 10:14 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: another Brakes question
Leighton wrote:
I can pump it up and it will stay solid for a few moments then just goes to sh1t.


Poorly adjusted drums can do this, unless, if it goes bad whilst you are holding the pedal down, then it's the master cylinder :wink:
Author:  Leighton [ Sun Jan 03, 2010 10:41 pm ]
Post subject: 
the drums are completely un-adjusted, are you saying to adjust them up and i may get a strong pedal, if the MC is not stuffed?
Author:  superSeven [ Mon Jan 04, 2010 12:04 am ]
Post subject: 
some good info in here:

http://www.ausmini.com/forums/viewtopic ... rum+brakes

and found this from Matt, found previously by wombat


Quote:
Found this from Matt:
If what you just said was actually true in that the peddle is solid,,, then it`s adjustment that is the problem

if the peddle is soft & spongey then there is air in the system & needs bleeding

To bleed front brakes, you will need to "UN_ADJUST" them first,,, then bleed them,,, & then "ADJUST" them back up

to un-adjust you will need to turn the adjusters opposit to the rotation of the wheels, then when udjusting them up after bleeding, you will need to turn the adjusters in the forward direction of the rotation of the wheels

to paint you all a picture to make it all make more sense-->

imagine laying under the car & turn your head so you`re looking at the backplate of the Left front wheel (passengers side) to adjust them up-->. turn both the adjusters clockwises

now looking at the right hand back plate,,, turn the adjusters anticlockwise

that is to udjust "UP" the front wheels
--------------------------------------------------

& obviously reverse that proceedure to "UN-Adjust"

& i`ll say it again,,, you will need to UN_ADJUST them BEFORE you bleed, Then Adjust them back up

If you have adjusted them the wrong way , then they will un-adjust themselves very very quickly & you will have a very low peddle again in no time at all

If it`s a low peddle but a solid peddle, then it`s adjustment

if it`s spongey peddle then it`s air & needs a bleed

if it`s a low & spongey peddle , then obviously you need to unadjust, then bleed, then re-adjust up

any questions????

As I said before there are 2 bleed nipples on some front drums - second one is tucked up under the steering arm
Author:  TheMiniMan [ Mon Jan 04, 2010 6:58 am ]
Post subject: 
you say the peddle goes away "while" you are holding the foot on it??? (master cyl problem)

or , does the peddle go away after you lift off & then on the next application it`s on the floor again??? (adjustment problem)
Author:  Gareth_1330 [ Mon Jan 04, 2010 7:26 am ]
Post subject: 
Yes, more info needed.

Sometimes i have felt drums that feel solid like discs but brake crap, sometimes i have felt drums that feel crap but work really well.

When i have had a M/cyl out of the car i stick it in a vice, pop a bleed nipple in the top and bleed it there. Its a good head start
Author:  4myego [ Mon Jan 04, 2010 7:41 am ]
Post subject: 
Re: Spongy pedal

A good trick Colin at Brookers brakes told me when I was having problems, Clamp each of the four brake hoses to close off and hit the pedal. Soft pedal = master cyl
Hard pedal = good master cyl - problem else where.

Next release one at a time. one rear first, test pedal, this will point you to the problem wheel / area.
Author:  Leighton [ Mon Jan 04, 2010 11:21 am ]
Post subject: 
yesterday the pedal was solid after a few pumps, but after i took my foot off the pedal and waited, say 10 seconds, it would go away.

i have just inspected the wheel cylinders on the front and there seems to be some fluid leaking past the connection pipe. can i put teflon tape on this or will the brake fluid just eat away at it. also, now after pumping the pedal i can not get any pedal pressure.

thanks for all the replies.

P.S 4myego, i might try that trick
Author:  drmini in aust [ Mon Jan 04, 2010 11:35 am ]
Post subject: 
The thread on the nipple doesn't seal the fluid in, you have a damaged pipe flare. Find another better pipe.
Author:  AEG163job [ Mon Jan 04, 2010 2:50 pm ]
Post subject: 
As the good Dr says, or try tightening it first with the proper hydraulic pipe (ring) spanner (7/16")-?. They need to be super tight.
Author:  drmini in aust [ Mon Jan 04, 2010 2:52 pm ]
Post subject: 
The proper spanner is a 7/16" `flare nut' one. They are a thick single hex ring spanner with a slot cut in.
If the hex head of the nipple is distorted already, do like I said- fling the pipe and get another.
Author:  Leighton [ Mon Jan 04, 2010 4:07 pm ]
Post subject: 
yep just came back from mini king with two new ones..
Author:  TheMiniMan [ Mon Jan 04, 2010 5:22 pm ]
Post subject: 
ok then,,, now that you have new pipes,,, fit them,,, & then ---> "UN_ADJUST" the front brakes (don`t worry about the backs, just un-adjust the fronts)

if you`re unsure of the correct direction or correct position of the brakes when they`re un-adjusted then take the drums off & have a look at the adjusters,,, they should be well clear of the shoes & the return springs should have pulled the shoes all the way home so that the pistons in the cyls are definately all the way in

then bleed them all,,, yes all 4 wheels,,, let all 4 bleed nipples loose & let em all drip freely,,, & keep the master-cyl topped up as they all just simply "Gravity" bleed

then , after you`ve had a cupper while they`re all bleeding,,, run around & do-up all the bleed nipples & then "ADJUST UP" the front brakes

Now,,, don`t forget that there is one "Correct" way to adjust the brakes & many "In-correct" ways

go with the forward rotation of the wheels,

if you have done all this correctly & if there are no more leaks,,, then hit the peddle & all should be well
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