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Clutch problem - another one!
https://www.ausmini.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=69214		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  garrathj [ Fri Mar 04, 2011 1:35 pm ]
Post subject:  Clutch problem - another one!
Hey everyone,
I had planned to have my Mini on the road for the 50th anniversary celebrations and had it booked in for a blue slip yesterday but ended up spending the whole afternoon trying to get the clutch working and missed my chance to get it on the road for the weekend :(

Hoping someone can help here...

I'll start with the symptoms:

Engine stopped - gears select fine
Engine started - It wont go into gear, no grinding, car will move forward a bit although by the end of the day it would go into 3rd and 4th with some effort although not 1st and 2nd.

If you start the car in 1st with the clutch in it starts no problem although when you pull it back to neutral it wont go back into gear.

What I have done:

New slave cylinder, new hose, kit through master cylinder, new clutch plate and recent bearing.

I had this engine/gearbox in my old mini running for a number of years with no real issues, before I took it out it started to display these symptoms but I put it down to hydraulics, that's why I replaced everything.

I did have an issue with the rod that goes into the slave cylinder being way too short but I swapped the arm and hopefully resolved that.

Would appreciate any help as this is the main issue keeping me off the road.

Cheers
Author:  VulcanBB18 [ Fri Mar 04, 2011 1:44 pm ]
Post subject: 
Gday,

First I would want to satisfy myself the clutch is actually engaging/disengaging.

Put the car into 1st and with your foot on the clutch, try and start it. (Be careful!! Assume it is going to take off on you, clear space, handbrake on, etc).

If it starts and you can drive off normally, then there's an issue with the box. If you can't start it, or it starts but wants to take off straight away, then the clutch is not disengaging properly = lack of travel at the throw-out bearing or another clutch setup problem.

hth

Jacob
Author:  garrathj [ Fri Mar 04, 2011 1:58 pm ]
Post subject: 
Thanks Jacob,
The car does start in gear as normal.

I was really hoping it wasn't the gearbox...
Author:  VulcanBB18 [ Fri Mar 04, 2011 2:09 pm ]
Post subject: 
Okay so it starts in gear, can you drive around after that? Does the clutch pick-up at the right point? Once you've started and moving, can you then select gears or does it feel like you're going to bend the gearstick?

I know it's not rego-ed yet but there's lots you can test in the driveway (just ask my neighbours! :lol:)

cheers,

Jacob
Author:  garrathj [ Fri Mar 04, 2011 2:15 pm ]
Post subject: 
I think it is pretty much OK to start off as normal in first once the car is started in gear, I haven't been able to drive and try 2nd yet though.

Thanks
Author:  Anto [ Fri Mar 04, 2011 2:16 pm ]
Post subject: 
How good is the clutch arm and the bearing carrier? They can wear really badly. Everything may look fine but the combined wear results in the slave cyl not being able to disengage the clutch properly.

This can give the appearance that the slave cylinder pushrod is too short and is often cause for people to bend their clutch arm in - rather than fix the actual problem.
Author:  simon k [ Fri Mar 04, 2011 2:19 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Clutch problem - another one!
Sounds like the arm and thrust carrier are worn out

garrathj wrote:
I did have an issue with the rod that goes into the slave cylinder being way too short but I swapped the arm and hopefully resolved that.


pull that arm out and inspect it - the ball on the end should be round and not worn on one side.
Author:  garrathj [ Fri Mar 04, 2011 2:29 pm ]
Post subject: 
I have tried 2 arms, the first was the thicker one and it was way to short, you can see the type down the page at:
http://www.ausmini.com/forums/viewtopic ... 5&start=15

In the second pic you can see that the rod is right at the end of the slave cylinder even when at rest.

I then tried the older thinner type that had been bent and had more success, both though aren't too bad at the ball end.

Thanks for the suggestions.
Author:  simon k [ Fri Mar 04, 2011 4:23 pm ]
Post subject: 
garrathj wrote:
I have tried 2 arms, the first was the thicker one and it was way to short, you can see the type down the page at:
http://www.ausmini.com/forums/viewtopic ... 5&start=15

In the second pic you can see that the rod is right at the end of the slave cylinder even when at rest.

I then tried the older thinner type that had been bent and had more success, both though aren't too bad at the ball end.

Thanks for the suggestions.


Image

jeez - there's something wierd going on if you need an arm that long

pull the wok off and have a look. The hole in the thrust carrier where the arm goes in wears too - I replaced my arm and carrier with new ones last year and it was like going back to a new car
Author:  garrathj [ Fri Mar 04, 2011 4:39 pm ]
Post subject: 
simon k wrote:
garrathj wrote:
I have tried 2 arms, the first was the thicker one and it was way to short, you can see the type down the page at:
http://www.ausmini.com/forums/viewtopic ... 5&start=15

In the second pic you can see that the rod is right at the end of the slave cylinder even when at rest.

I then tried the older thinner type that had been bent and had more success, both though aren't too bad at the ball end.

Thanks for the suggestions.


Image

jeez - there's something wierd going on if you need an arm that long

pull the wok off and have a look. The hole in the thrust carrier where the arm goes in wears too - I replaced my arm and carrier with new ones last year and it was like going back to a new car


Yes, the small adjusting bolt in the wok has to be extra long too, I think you are on to something there, the arm does seem way to far out although there doesn't seem to be much play in the thrust carrier.

Unfortunately the engine is in the car so its not so easy to take out now...
Author:  VulcanBB18 [ Fri Mar 04, 2011 5:46 pm ]
Post subject: 
No need to drop the engine out. Just prop/jack under the sump to take the weight of the engine and you can get the wok off. I agree with Simon, something strange going on, I'd bet bearing carrier too.

cheers,

Jacob
Author:  garrathj [ Fri Mar 04, 2011 5:55 pm ]
Post subject: 
VulcanBB18 wrote:
No need to drop the engine out. Just prop/jack under the sump to take the weight of the engine and you can get the wok off. I agree with Simon, something strange going on, I'd bet bearing carrier too.

cheers,

Jacob


Definitely, done that before, better than taking the engine out...just!

Will be good if thats the problem, not selecting gears still concerns me though.
Author:  garrathj [ Sat Mar 05, 2011 11:58 am ]
Post subject: 
I've done some more research and am thinking it may be the clutch too rather than the gearbox as I feared.

If you have the wheels off the ground in gear with the engine running the wheels spin even with the clutch in, not just slightly but similar to if it were out.

I think I'll have to pull the cover off and replace the bearing carrier, arm and may as well put a new bearing while I have it off. Will see if that helps bring the arm closer to the wok and gives me the right travel.

Make sense?
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