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Dude, brakes/steering, stuff about drum brakes in race cars
https://www.ausmini.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=7744		 Page 1 of 5
Author:  FatMaserati [ Wed Jun 01, 2005 11:36 pm ]
Post subject:  Dude, brakes/steering, stuff about drum brakes in race cars
Oh man, I need to fix my steering and get some damn discs on the front! The steering is soooo sloppy, you can jiggle the steering wheel back and forth a fair bit and it doesn't change the direction the car is going at all. Pot holes will make you aim for the curb, or the car in the other lane. Braking, even slightly hard, will steer the car to the right fairly sharply, so I have to turn left to compensate, but the steering wheel is a bit sloppy so you don't know how much you actually have to correct before you actually brake...........waffles on........trails off......


DUDE, WHERE'S MY BRAKES AND STEERING?

EDIT: Booked in to get it all fixed.
Author:  willy [ Wed Jun 01, 2005 11:42 pm ]
Post subject: 
Check:
The two bolts that go into the hub part from the steering rack arms.
Also check the bushings and tightness of all bolts in this area.
Inspect for wear on the steering arm bits.

After thats done, adjust your brakes so they stop you in a straight line.

I'm hoping you havent bent a steering arm.
I did and it cost me like 300 bux (incl. labour) to get done.

Fingers are crossed.

Oh, and i didnt hit anything - must have had a slight bend in it and hammered itself into a bit more of a bend over time and small bumps in the road. Quite odd, yes.

Good luck.
Author:  Mike [ Thu Jun 02, 2005 5:58 am ]
Post subject: 
Mate, sorry, but if you've been driving the car in this condition youre a Dick.
Author:  Wolfman [ Thu Jun 02, 2005 8:47 am ]
Post subject: 
Mike wrote:
Mate, sorry, but if you've been driving the car in this condition youre a Dick.


Totally agree with that statement, not only are you risking your car and life but other roadusers as well :evil:
Author:  Lillee [ Thu Jun 02, 2005 9:30 am ]
Post subject: 
:shock:

Just take it to a garage and get it fixed! a few $100 is worth your life aint it??

Nothing wrong with good drum brakes... mine stop just as good as 7.5inch brakes (for the first few times that is, after that they start to fade :lol: ). But if yours doesn't work well then it isn't anything to do with having discs or not...

Some guys at the MCC tell me that if you install a brake booster with drums they will work very very well for a road car... I tend to believe them as mine work great... cept for the fade...
Author:  aaron [ Thu Jun 02, 2005 11:30 am ]
Post subject: 
Properly adjusted and maintained drums are just as good as a set of disc's, as 68d says, they will fade with constant braking downhill. you should also adjust your drums at least once a month to maintain good brakes with drums. 68d's comment on using a booster is an interesting idea, hadn't thought about it, but i know one guy that has a booster with drums and it works well, so i am told, so hey if you got one handy, why not. can't hurt to not have to push the pedal so hard.

Cheers
Aaron
Author:  Mini Mad [ Thu Jun 02, 2005 11:39 am ]
Post subject: 
The booster worked well with my drums..it'd stop well ONCE in an emergency/hard brake, then you would rapidly loose efficiency..

Now i have 9.2" brakes with a servo :mrgreen:
Author:  Lillee [ Thu Jun 02, 2005 12:11 pm ]
Post subject: 
Hehe and boy your clubman stops well! :lol:

Actually I can't fit a servo under the bonnet because I run a matic fresh air heater... I need to mount it inside the car on the passenger side if I want to do that.

Anyway I don't like overly sensative brakes (same as Dr Mini) as I can't effectly heal toe if it's too sensative.... but that's just me. I think 7.5inch discs brakes well enough without a booster. I drove Barney and he stops very well without a booster and I could heal toe easily (not that I drove him too hard ok Kev? :P :wink: ) so I will copy that.
Author:  FatMaserati [ Thu Jun 02, 2005 12:12 pm ]
Post subject: 
Mike wrote:
Mate, sorry, but if you've been driving the car in this condition youre a Dick.


Fair nuff, but I'm also not a tool who thinks he can drive at 140 down suburban streets. Nor do I weave in and out of traffic. I also indicate when I'm turning. I leave myself more than enough time to brake if the person in front of me brakes suddenly. Even with my car in this crappy state, I'm still a safer driver than most people. Tell the P-platers standing next to their turbo'd up Skylines after they just wrapped it around a pole that they are dicks. It's getting fixed ASAP, BTW.

And by the way, only helpful comments would be appreciated from now on.

Sticking with the drums is not an option. 1430 needs the 8.4" discs on the front, and some tight drums on the rear.
Author:  Lillee [ Thu Jun 02, 2005 12:21 pm ]
Post subject: 
What? you run 1430cc and drums??? how did you get it registered?!?

That's downright... ugly to say the least! and since your drums don't work well too then sorry but you are a dick! :( :shock: :wink:

I am about to build a 100bhp+ 1360cc and won't even contemplate putting it in without discs as a minimum! I'm even thinking about 4 pot calipers before even starting the engine build...
Author:  Mini Mad [ Thu Jun 02, 2005 12:23 pm ]
Post subject: 
lol..what? you mean we can't do 140 down suburban streets? :lol:
Author:  Lillee [ Thu Jun 02, 2005 12:27 pm ]
Post subject: 
Helpful comment:

Your drums probably actually do work well, it's just that with the power you are running from your 1430cc they fade in the first 2 traffic lights and that's why they seem like they're not working at all.

I suggest NOT DRIVING until you figure out the brakes situation to start with and fix your steering before you have none! If you were pulled over I am sure the coppers will defect you with a modded engine and no drum brakes...

Dun be fooled dude... driving a faulty car is just as bad as hooning around in a 300KW supercar on your P's!

I aint having a go at you, I am trying to be helpful! :lol:
Author:  FatMaserati [ Thu Jun 02, 2005 12:45 pm ]
Post subject: 
I live in Perth, the land of no annual vehicle inspections to keep the car licenced.

It has just had its engine all rebuilt and new block etc. so it's number is now different, meaning I really should get it all reregistered. Which I will. When I know it will pass. After discs and steering is fixed. LOL!
Author:  fuzzy-hair-man [ Thu Jun 02, 2005 1:16 pm ]
Post subject: 
Why do people seem to think it is harder to stop a 1430 from 100km/hr to 0km/hr than it is to stop an 850 even from 100km/hr to 0km/hr. Unless you brake with the clutch out and your foot on the accerator then I can't see why drums and a 1430 is inheritly dangerous (OK putting on flame proof suit) now let me explain a bit....

to me brakes are responsible for slowing wieght. a 1430 weighs about the same as most other versions of a mini. This is not saying that I don't think a 1430 requires disks I think it does. The driver is expecting / wanting to drive it in a spirited manner and will accelerate quicker and so will more readily need to slow down which is where drum brakes fall down ie brake fade.

BUT If you are temporily driving with drums on a 1430 and do not push the drums to the limit of thier braking abilities then why are drums on a 1430 inheritly unsafe?????

By the way IMO you don't need a 1430 to push drums beyond thier limits you could probably do this easily with an 850 just go down a hill riding your brakes the whole way your drums would heat up cook themselves and when you got to the bottom you'd have no brakes.
You could kill yourself doing the same thing with disks as well

Also a 1430 will give a bit of an engine breaking advantage in that more gas is inducted and therefore more gas is compressed by the engine requiring more power. So with your foot of the go pedal you will have more engine breaking so there will be marginly less load on your brakes.

the fact that disks seem standard with an engine 1275 or above is a symtom of it being standard on the cooper S (which would be expected to be driven harder than a more standard mini) I reckon that after the S had disks every other 1275 version had to have them. This is also a symtom of rego requirements in that to avoid having to get a engineers certificate for an engine upgrade for a 998 block to a 1275 block you need to be at specifacations comparible to a mini version that had a 1275 as they all had disk brakes then you need disk brakes.

I don't know but an engineer might be able to pass a 1275 with drums my father who incidently was an RTA registered inspector could see no reason that my 1275 should nessicarily have to fail with just drums (I got disks because like many here I anticipate driving my mini in a spirited manner(but not unsafe) and don't want to worry about brake fade I also didn't really want to have rego / insurance hassles)

Sorry for the rant but it is not nice to call each other idiots I mean I wasn't nessicarily even sure the 1430 was in the car at the time (I realized it was because of the thread on extractors) and yes I agree dodgy brakes and steering racks should be fixed ASAP on whatever car.

Sorry again for the rant :oops:
Author:  Mini Mad [ Thu Jun 02, 2005 1:35 pm ]
Post subject: 
Yea, i kinda agree with that...

and chong 300kW is no supercar :lol:
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