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Re-shelling a hypothetical
https://www.ausmini.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=77838		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  Giantinamini [ Mon Jul 30, 2012 7:31 pm ]
Post subject:  Re-shelling a hypothetical
What are your thoughts on people getting a written off classic car of worth. For arguments sake a Mk1 Cooper S and re-shelling it. So taking every piece off that Cooper and putting it onto a non-cooper Shell. Do they have the right to call it a Cooper S?
Author:  bnicho [ Mon Jul 30, 2012 7:39 pm ]
Post subject: 
Maxi23 wrote:
I can't wait to see where this thread ends up.


Yeah, here we go again!! :roll:
Author:  danny_ [ Mon Jul 30, 2012 7:39 pm ]
Post subject: 
You should be able to call your car what ever you want.
Author:  PDJ [ Mon Jul 30, 2012 7:40 pm ]
Post subject: 
Here we go :roll:

Might be best to do a search as its a very hot topic.
And in a word No. It should never be called a genuine Cooper S.
Author:  drmini in aust [ Mon Jul 30, 2012 7:44 pm ]
Post subject: 
You might get away with that in the UK.
If it's not in a real S body in this country, it is an S replica.
Nothing wrong with that (we owned a good one)- just don't represent that it is a real S. This is fraud.

A good S replica is probably worth around 1/2 what the real thing is, hence why people dud them up.
Author:  Giantinamini [ Mon Jul 30, 2012 7:48 pm ]
Post subject: 
good to see most agree, i was having an argument today
Author:  goodie [ Mon Jul 30, 2012 9:41 pm ]
Post subject: 
PDJ wrote:
It should never be called a genuine Cooper S.


" Genuine " , being the operative word !
Author:  MG Rocket [ Mon Jul 30, 2012 10:07 pm ]
Post subject: 
Nothing wrong with the idea.
I would rather drive a faithful replica then the real thing any day.
BUT to sell it as a genuine S would be simply wrong....very wrong.
Any person doing this, just put yourself in the position of the buyer......How would you feel finding out later it had been re-shelled.
Author:  1275LS [ Mon Jul 30, 2012 10:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Re-shelling a hypothetical
Giantinamini wrote:
What are your thoughts on people getting a written off classic car of worth. For arguments sake a Mk1 Cooper S and re-shelling it. So taking every piece off that Cooper and putting it onto a non-cooper Shell. Do they have the right to call it a Cooper S?


Here is another side to it...

Should the owner part the bits out to other Cooper S owners to restore their cars so the remaining ones are able to be kept more genuine?

Might make a change from the real vs replica vs fraud debate.

I'm on the "no" side by the way...
Author:  willy [ Tue Jul 31, 2012 1:22 am ]
Post subject: 
danny_ wrote:
You should be able to call your car what ever you want.


Very wrong.

Deceit (fraudulence) is a criminal offence.
Author:  ryan [ Tue Jul 31, 2012 7:01 am ]
Post subject: 
I think it's extremely wrong and as far as I was aware, illegal.
Author:  frednutz&co [ Tue Jul 31, 2012 7:09 am ]
Post subject: 
when is a replica
not a genuine car ?
is it made of plastic or metal
basically all our cars are genuine
just that some have been assembled in a slightly different form .
some have more bits than others
some have different sized motors ,
some have different brake systems ,
if you were to start from a bare basic shell
and assemble all original parts ,you could say you had a genuine cooper S
just a new build.
for example (slight different track)
using old plans new timber build a boat
is it a replica ?

how many "works race cars "
are the ORIGINAL car as built in64??
just my thoughts.

but then again a reshell is not the original car and a clone is just that.
Author:  drmini in aust [ Tue Jul 31, 2012 10:22 am ]
Post subject: 
If you started with a NEW bare shell it won't have any ID numbers on it.
And (in this country anyway) it's illegal to then stamp the numbers on it from your old car to reshell it.
But I think that is legal in UK, and it definitely is legal in California.
Just not here- in the land of convicts and felons. :roll:
Author:  Irish Yobbo [ Tue Jul 31, 2012 11:04 am ]
Post subject: 
drmini in aust wrote:
If you started with a NEW bare shell it won't have any ID numbers on it.
And (in this country anyway) it's illegal to then stamp the numbers on it from your old car to reshell it.
But I think that is legal in UK, and it definitely is legal in California.
Just not here- in the land of convicts and felons. :roll:


It's still a bit of a grey area though. Suppose I get a cooper S write-off. If I replace the fenders, doors, bonnet, roof, sills, floors, boot and side panels, it's still a cooper s. When does cutting pieces of a non-genuine shell and welding them onto the genuine one switch the other way around? If I cut everything off from the bonnet back and weld on a non-genuine, is that still genuine?

I'm of the opinion you can call it what you want, but if it isn't the original shell (grey area!) then it should be sold as a replica.
Author:  bnicho [ Tue Jul 31, 2012 11:22 am ]
Post subject: 
drmini in aust wrote:
But I think that is legal in UK, and it definitely is legal in California.
Just not here- in the land of convicts and felons. :roll:


It's not legal in the UK to restamp the number. The new Heritage shells come with a number that identifies it a replacement shell. However if a reshell is done legally the DVLA still see it as the same car (when told about thew new VIN) and it retain's its original registration number.

The UK has silly rules too. New parts count as original, but used parts form another car don't even if it's the same part. So if you use the old shell from car A, subframes from car B and engine from car C and the DVLA find out, then the car loses it's identity and is issued a "Q" numberplate like a kit car. :roll:
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