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PostPosted: Mon Aug 13, 2012 12:51 pm 
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After some opinions on the RE83 vs the Wade 446b.
Both have been recommended for my purpose of more low down torque than high end power.
I'm building a 1380 with standard 940 head and 45 weber.

Leaning toward the RE83, GR said it works best with standard rockers.
But, Wade cams are close to home and easy.
Lesser known but has anyone run the 446b?

Also, people always talk cam models but what actual figures should I be looking for in a cam that is torquey rather than all top end?

Cheers

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 13, 2012 1:03 pm 
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Ask Lindsay Seibler at Minis Plus.
He likens the RE83 to a diesel cam, it has so much low down & midrange oomph! :lol:

Generally, the more duration a cam has, the better its top end and worse its bottom end is.
The RE83 concept works because it has low duration (260°?) but steep flanks on the lobes for valve acceleration, and a good big nose radius. And good valve lift. The big radius means they don't wear themselves out like a Swiftune SW5 (for an extreme example) does.
It works best with 1.3:1 rockers, NOT 1.5s.

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DrMini- 1970 wasaMatic 1360, Mk1S crank, 86.6HP (ATW) =~125 @ crank, 45 Dellorto (38 chokes), RE282 sprint cam, 1.5 rockers, 11.0:1 C/R. :mrgreen:


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 13, 2012 2:56 pm 
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You'll get better bottom end torque out of a standard cam, and running high compression than you will out of any persformance cam... but, you wouldn't have bothered going to 1380 if all you wanted was a motor that starts to run out of puff before 5000rpm :lol: a cam similar to what the doc is suggesting with low duration and low lift will still give reasonable torque down low and more poke every where else. I've found that even with low duration cams, if the lift is too high you will still see a drop in bottom end torque.

I agree with the doc that from a performance point of veiw, a fast accelerating flank and large nose radius are desireable (:lol: just remember that as your flank acceleration rate increases, your tappet clearance also needs to increase so make sure you refer to the cam grinder for new clearances)...... As for pointy cams wearing out quicker, if the cam rubbed over the follower instead of turning it, yes it would wear out quicker.. but the 2 surfaces don't rub. Also if there wasn't a continous radius in the face of the lobe, then yes, it would try and bang its nose off as it passes over the follower, but there is a continuous radius.. which means that the lobe only makes contact on the same tiny tangent point regardless of where the valve is closed, opening, fully opened or on the way down...

Lubricants aside for a moment, the only friction created (provided the cam has been ground correctly to begin with) is as a result of the valve springs transfering pressure back down the valve train to the face of the lobe. Thats in a static situation. Once its in motion, whats happening to the lobe, is the surface of the lobe is being pulled as it turns the follower. As the load on the lobe increases (ie as the valve is opened more) the tension on the surface of the lobe increases....... If anything, a larger nose radius increases the period of time that the lobe surface is exposed to peak tension... there is more friction borne on the lobe surface with large nose radius cams per cycle as a result.

There is one local company (that the doc and I have both had experience with) that I have recently found do not heat treat their cams properly.... This would have a dramatic effect on how long the cam lasts... I have also had experience with one UK company that don't temper their cams properly, and as a result you can phyiscally see stress cracks in the surface from where it has been quenched... at least its hard I guess, but this still isn't a good look.

The "pointy profiled" VP3 that you wore out in 50,000 Km, came from the local company that I have since found no sweet FA about metallurgy, or the importance even chosing the right steels for turning up billets for cams. I dare say that the "Pointy" cam you had that wore out so quickly, wore out because it either wasn't ground properly or heat treated properly.


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 13, 2012 3:14 pm 
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A Tighe 112 or 104 would also be a good choice, as would a Wade 104, or a current APT VP7 (wouldn't go any wilder than the VP7 if you want to keep as much of your bottom end as possible.. though in a 1380 it should be fine).. Swiftune don't have anything listed that suits what you're after

http://www.wadecams.com/ <----- you'll find the wade profiles here under "popular profiles" --> BMC A series, couldn't post a direct link I'm sorry

http://www.tighecams.com.au/cars.htm

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/19278540/pdf%20 ... PVP345.pdf

(above link came from http://www.aptfast.com/content/a-series.aspx)


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 13, 2012 4:24 pm 
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I had a Tighe or Wade 104 in Barney (1293A+, twin HS4s, 1.46 Corolla rockers) and the bottom end was OK but nothing to write home about.
The 104 (this example, anyway) has pretty poor lift, that's why I used the `Rolla rockers.
It did make 59.4HP ATW at the dyno day.. but felt tame after mine... see specs below. :lol:

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DrMini- 1970 wasaMatic 1360, Mk1S crank, 86.6HP (ATW) =~125 @ crank, 45 Dellorto (38 chokes), RE282 sprint cam, 1.5 rockers, 11.0:1 C/R. :mrgreen:


Last edited by drmini in aust on Mon Aug 13, 2012 4:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 13, 2012 4:27 pm 
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Nice one. Cheers.
Lindsay has suggested inlets valves bigger than standard S ones in the 940 to make the re83 worthwhile.

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 13, 2012 6:03 pm 
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drmini in aust wrote:
I had a Tighe or Wade 104 in Barney (1293A+, twin HS4s, 1.46 Corolla rockers) and the bottom end was OK but nothing to write home about.
The 104 (this example, anyway) has pretty poor lift, that's why I used the `Rolla rockers.
It did make 59.4HP ATW at the dyno day.. but felt tame after mine... see specs below. :lol:


Well, gotta say, it is a mild road cam, I think it was doing well getting 59.4hp ATW. Thats pretty awesome and says a lot about the quality of the build :)


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