ausmini :: View topic - Wheel Wobbles-Bearings or Ball Joints?

Hi Doc
I'm heading down to Minisport today to pickup some genuine Timkin wheel bearings as the ones I installed are cheap aftermarket types.
I had another look this morning and the wheels on my 850 (which has the same aftermarket bearings and is being restored so hasn't been driven yet) have the exact same problem.
I couldn't see any movement in the ball joints and after reading your thread, I now suspect the bearing spacers suppled with the aftermarket bearings units are too thick and this may be causing the wheel wobble problems.
Have you had any similar issues with Timkin roller bearings or is this just a problem with the cheaper aftermarket types?
Also, do the older ball bearing types have the same issues as I've heard these don't require a fine tolerance preload like the tapered bearings.
Any advice would be much appreciated.
Thanks
Dave

Author:	captainwaldopepper [ Sun Mar 16, 2014 8:42 pm ]
Post subject:	Wheel Wobbles-Bearings or Ball Joints?
Hi all I've noticed that both the front wheels of my van wobble from side to side slightly when the van is jacked up. I recently installed new front tapered roller bearings and ball joints as per the Haynes manual and tightened everything up to the recommended torque settings when it all went back together. I was sure the ball joints had no slop in them when I installed them in the hub as they seemed to be nice and tight but they move about now that the steering gear is installed. I'm now wondering whether I've done something wrong with the ball joints or if there is a chance that the inside diameter of the new tapered roller bearings is larger than the driveshafts and this is causing the wheel wobble. Ill be pulling off the hubs this week to recheck the ball joints and bearings and most likely will put more shims in the ball joints to tighten things up. I have a standard two shoe drum brake setup with rubber coupling driveshafts Any suggestions from more experienced Mini mechanics on what else I should be looking for if it's not the ball joints? Cheers Dave

Author:	drmini in aust [ Sun Mar 16, 2014 8:50 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Wheel Wobbles-Bearings or Ball Joints?
Get someone to rock the wheel whilst you look underneath, it should be obvious if it's the balljoints or the bearings. If the bearings are loose it's possible that the swivel hub is worn inside on the web where the bearing cups seat. It's also possible (but unlikely) that the bearings have the wrong spacer. I helped a member this weekend fit new noname roller bearings into new swivel hubs. One side the preload was fine, the other side felt lumpy when torqued up. It needed a spacer .003" thicker than supplied... See my wheel bearing thread in the how-to forum. [edit] typo

Author:	captainwaldopepper [ Sun Mar 16, 2014 8:58 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Wheel Wobbles-Bearings or Ball Joints?
Thanks Doc I'll certainly check out your wheel bearing thread. Hopefully it's just ball joints as that would be the cheaper option. The swivel hubs could be worn though as they are the 1964 originals and the van was used as workhorse. I'll let you know how things go once I've pulled the hubs off. Regards Dave

Author:	captainwaldopepper [ Mon Mar 17, 2014 7:05 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Wheel Wobbles-Bearings or Ball Joints?
Hi Doc I'm heading down to Minisport today to pickup some genuine Timkin wheel bearings as the ones I installed are cheap aftermarket types. I had another look this morning and the wheels on my 850 (which has the same aftermarket bearings and is being restored so hasn't been driven yet) have the exact same problem. I couldn't see any movement in the ball joints and after reading your thread, I now suspect the bearing spacers suppled with the aftermarket bearings units are too thick and this may be causing the wheel wobble problems. Have you had any similar issues with Timkin roller bearings or is this just a problem with the cheaper aftermarket types? Also, do the older ball bearing types have the same issues as I've heard these don't require a fine tolerance preload like the tapered bearings. Any advice would be much appreciated. Thanks Dave

Author:	drmini in aust [ Mon Mar 17, 2014 7:37 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Wheel Wobbles-Bearings or Ball Joints?
captainwaldopepper wrote: Hi Doc I'm heading down to Minisport today to pickup some genuine Timkin wheel bearings as the ones I installed are cheap aftermarket types. I had another look this morning and the wheels on my 850 (which has the same aftermarket bearings and is being restored so hasn't been driven yet) have the exact same problem. I couldn't see any movement in the ball joints and after reading your thread, I now suspect the bearing spacers suppled with the aftermarket bearings units are too thick and this may be causing the wheel wobble problems. Have you had any similar issues with Timkin roller bearings or is this just a problem with the cheaper aftermarket types? Also, do the older ball bearing types have the same issues as I've heard these don't require a fine tolerance preload like the tapered bearings. Any advice would be much appreciated. Thanks Dave I find the aftermarket bearings OK if used with a spacer that gives correct .001-.002" preload. As I have previously stated this is often not the spacer they supply in the kit. I always keep old spacers, in addition I have a few 1/2 machined (wider) ones that I finish machine to width if needed. I've not had spacer problems with Timkens except on an old 997 Cooper swivel hub which was badly worn in the centre web. If you fit Timkens and they are still loose, I'd say the hub's web is worn from the bearing cups spinning against it. So preload is lost. The solution then is either renew the swivel hub, or follow my thread re measuring the endfloat, then machining the spacer width. This has to be done accurately, the spacer has to be parallel when finished. If the bearing cups are loose in the hub, renew the hub. But if they are still a neat fit but can just be spun by hand, I have had success with Loctite 609. Ball bearings can have the same spacer width problem when fitted to old swivel hubs. This is made worse on recent bearings with a 1/2 integral spacer on each. These cannot be machined, they need to be surface ground if found too wide.

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Wheel Wobbles-Bearings or Ball Joints? https://www.ausmini.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=84918	Page 1 of 1

Author:	Irish Yobbo [ Mon Mar 17, 2014 8:06 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Wheel Wobbles-Bearings or Ball Joints?
I installed some non-timken wheel bearings when doing my disc conversion, and I assembled one which felt fine, and then the next one was too tight (it didn't turn freely, it 'locked up' in some places). I swapped the spacers and both were fine. In future I'd use the timkens - the cheap ones aren't worth the hassle.

Author:	captainwaldopepper [ Tue Mar 18, 2014 8:43 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Wheel Wobbles-Bearings or Ball Joints?
Just fitted the Timkin front roller bearings, torqued everything up and no more wheel wobbles Thanks Doc

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