ausmini :: View topic - Switch to Dual Circuit brakes

I am installing dual circuit in anticipation of similar requirement.... didn't know warning light was necessary.. but easy to wire up.
It will trigger on fluid level in reservoir - there is a vertical divider making separate chambers.

Working on same principle:
Keep existing proportioning valve.
Keep existing rear cylinders (appropriate to brake type)

This setup is basically how factory did with early dual circuit kits... so unless someone tells me I'm mad...
I am not fitting a PWDA valve - as using the rear proportioning valve - and is just more hassle for no major benefit.

NOTE: Yellow tag Master cylinder is METRIC - old lines will be UNF - so conversion pipes needed.
I'm using braided hoses to the brake booster - so in theory do not have to disconnect if taking engine out .
That kit came with Metric banjo bolts and had to buy UNF.
I had to change to tin type Clutch master to clear pipes.

NOTE: You can screw UNF into the top port - but will probably not seal correctly !

http://mk1-performance-conversions.co.uk/comps_dept_special_tuning.htm

Author:	Morbo28 [ Fri Feb 26, 2016 12:06 pm ]
Post subject:	Switch to Dual Circuit brakes
Hi guys, I just spoke to the engineer about certifying my mini (in the build thread below). He says I need to upgrade from the current single circuit system (I'm running the tin type master cylinder) to a dual circuit system that incorporates a brake pressure warning light. I need to dig around and research what specific parts I need to give me both the dual system and the warning lights. I also need to know if I keep the rear proportioning valve and the rear slave cylinders I have (for rear drums matched to font disc setup). I have all new plumbing for the standard setup so ideally if I could keep that that would be great. But obviously if I need to I will ditch those and start from scratch. Any recommendations on what I should do?

Author:	michaelb [ Fri Feb 26, 2016 12:37 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Switch to Dual Circuit brakes
Hi I have used the later Rover master cylinder , yellow tag, with 2 outputs for brakes. I had all new stainless pipes made up so I was able to have the correct fittings for the new master cylinder which has different size threads for the front and rear outputs Read the info on Mini-spares website about different brake types and setups, I found it very helpfull I have also fitted a new rear brake limiting valve The brakes work really well, minisport 4 pot with Cooper S rear cylinders and mini fin drums

Author:	timmy201 [ Fri Feb 26, 2016 12:42 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Switch to Dual Circuit brakes
michaelb wrote: Read the info onMinispares website about different brake types and setups The chart is here: http://www.minispares.com/catalogues/cl ... px?1~9~105

Author:	Morbo28 [ Fri Feb 26, 2016 3:56 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Switch to Dual Circuit brakes
Thanks guys. Maybe this one...do you know if it is compatible with the brake warning light? Just trying to find more info on it to confirm its the way to go

Author:	Harley [ Fri Feb 26, 2016 5:15 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Switch to Dual Circuit brakes
Yes, the warning light float switch is in the cap.

ausmini https://www.ausmini.com/forums/

Switch to Dual Circuit brakes https://www.ausmini.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=91948	Page 1 of 2

Author:	MINImal effort [ Fri Feb 26, 2016 7:51 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Switch to Dual Circuit brakes
I am installing dual circuit in anticipation of similar requirement.... didn't know warning light was necessary.. but easy to wire up. It will trigger on fluid level in reservoir - there is a vertical divider making separate chambers. Working on same principle: Keep existing proportioning valve. Keep existing rear cylinders (appropriate to brake type) This setup is basically how factory did with early dual circuit kits... so unless someone tells me I'm mad... I am not fitting a PWDA valve - as using the rear proportioning valve - and is just more hassle for no major benefit. NOTE: Yellow tag Master cylinder is METRIC - old lines will be UNF - so conversion pipes needed. I'm using braided hoses to the brake booster - so in theory do not have to disconnect if taking engine out . That kit came with Metric banjo bolts and had to buy UNF. I had to change to tin type Clutch master to clear pipes. NOTE: You can screw UNF into the top port - but will probably not seal correctly ! http://mk1-performance-conversions.co.uk/comps_dept_special_tuning.htm

Author:	Bubbacluby [ Fri Feb 26, 2016 8:33 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Switch to Dual Circuit brakes
Morbo28 wrote: Hi guys, I just spoke to the engineer about certifying my mini (in the build thread below). He says I need to upgrade from the current single circuit system (I'm running the tin type master cylinder) to a dual circuit system that incorporates a brake pressure warning light. Why are you talking to an engineer about your car when you havn't changed anything to non-mini (you know what I mean) or changed anything structually? dual brakes didnt come out until about 77, 9yrs after your car, why do you require them? Im curious, as I thought things only needed engineering when you are changing things structually or going engine replacement?

Author:	dalmeny [ Fri Feb 26, 2016 9:16 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Switch to Dual Circuit brakes
I'll stand corrected if need be, but I always thought the front piston in a duel circuit master activated the rear and the piston (closest to the push rod activated the front) therefore I may have run the brake lines differently. But, in saying that I have not worked on that particular type of master cylinder. OK, WENT BACK AND READ THE MINI SPARES INFO. I'M WRONG..

Author:	MINImal effort [ Fri Feb 26, 2016 9:31 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Switch to Dual Circuit brakes
I just doubled checked as well. Some master cylinders were the other way but this one lower is rear. VSB14 has a dual circuit brakes a mandatory requirement for pre ADR cars if increasing power beyond 20% of a standard engine. So a supercharger would do this.... Mine is less obvious (as just cam, porting , carbs etc) and will be whether Engineer gets interested or not....

Author:	Morbo28 [ Sat Feb 27, 2016 1:14 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Switch to Dual Circuit brakes
Hey guys. It's 2am and I've just come from a party so may be slightly inebriated. But a cursory look at your responses suggests the following. I invited the engineer to look at the car due to the addition of the supercharger, to make sure he is happy with the braking setup and also on a personal level I wanted him to confirm that my front and rear seatbelt mounts were as good as possible and get his opinion on the baby seat mounting points.

Author:	Morbo28 [ Sat Feb 27, 2016 1:20 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Switch to Dual Circuit brakes
Oh and PS I agree with the nature of what you said Minimal Effort - ie you could have a lumpy cammed 1380 making the same power as me but no need for extra scrutiny. Seems to be the way with forced induction. I will read all of your replies I detail when I am more fully in control of my faculties. Honestly though I will never really hang too much crap on someone telling me to make safety mods. (Though I appreciate adding dual circuits may not directly improve braking).

Author:	timmy201 [ Sat Feb 27, 2016 4:16 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Switch to Dual Circuit brakes
This is for NSW: If you look at item #2 on page 3, adding a turbo or supercharger to a vehicle not factory fitted with one requires certification. http://www.rms.nsw.gov.au/documents/roa ... ations.pdf Adding more than 20% in power to the standard engine also requires certification, which I'm not sure how they would determine

Author:	bluewhitecoopers1968 [ Sat Feb 27, 2016 7:57 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Switch to Dual Circuit brakes
MINImal effort wrote: I am installing dual circuit in anticipation of similar requirement.... didn't know warning light was necessary.. but easy to wire up. It will trigger on fluid level in reservoir - there is a vertical divider making separate chambers. Working on same principle: Keep existing proportioning valve. Keep existing rear cylinders (appropriate to brake type) This setup is basically how factory did with early dual circuit kits... so unless someone tells me I'm mad... I am not fitting a PWDA valve - as using the rear proportioning valve - and is just more hassle for no major benefit. NOTE: Yellow tag Master cylinder is METRIC - old lines will be UNF - so conversion pipes needed. I'm using braided hoses to the brake booster - so in theory do not have to disconnect if taking engine out . That kit came with Metric banjo bolts and had to buy UNF. I had to change to tin type Clutch master to clear pipes. NOTE: You can screw UNF into the top port - but will probably not seal correctly ! http://mk1-performance-conversions.co.uk/comps_dept_special_tuning.htm Correct me if I'm wrong but the picture shows the front brakes will be boosted but not the rear. Isn't this dangerous?

Author:	Jonnoh [ Sat Feb 27, 2016 9:34 am ]
Post subject:	Switch to Dual Circuit brakes
Hi all. On a similar thread I didn't realise these requirements re: modifications required if power is >120%. These are definitely the rules? If that's the case I need two speed wipers, collapsible steering, tandem brakes.....! Joy.

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Author:	Morbo28 [ Sat Feb 27, 2016 1:41 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Switch to Dual Circuit brakes
Alrighty ... Spanish Eggs and coffee and a nap and I'm fighting fit. Thanks for that photo and info thanks Minimal Effort. I think I will do a similar thing but use the one I screenshotted in my earlier post. That way the fittings are all original/imperial. Once I install the brakes I have to take it to one of the car dealer service departments and get them to do a "platronic" brake test. Apparently they drive the car at very low speed (~5 kph) and hit the brakes over four sensors (one under each wheel). They record percentage brake bias and pedal effort and confirm everything is within spec. Once I is I take that report to the engineer for final certification. Okay sweet thanks all I think I have a good plan now.