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| Twin Turbo G13B https://www.ausmini.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=32285 |
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| Author: | 65_mini_deluxe [ Wed May 30, 2007 5:00 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Twin Turbo G13B |
hi, ive been thinking (dangerous i know), would a twin turbo be possible on a suzuki G13B in a mini engine bay, probably clubman. Or is there another issue with the engine, like high compression, or doesnt like twin turboes. If eventually it did happen it would have a massive intercooler and as reliable as possible. Is this an impossible dream? I thought about it because of the unlengthened front and it could get as much power as a VTEC, or am i completely wrong? Thanks for your time Joe |
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| Author: | gzeVan [ Wed May 30, 2007 6:41 pm ] |
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if you want big power close to the hondas you would have to use one big turbo gt28 size. twins would not really work well, as splitting the exaust pulse into two turbos would only leave you with 650cc of engine per turbo which would only allow you to run fairly small turbos to be usefull on the road I think if you twin charged with a supercharger down low and a big turbo for the top end it would be pretty good |
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| Author: | Stuartminidlx [ Wed May 30, 2007 6:53 pm ] |
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i have seen it one a 1.3l charade using two tiny turbo off a three cylinder 850. but i was more for the wank factor than all out power. |
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| Author: | 998_Clubman [ Wed May 30, 2007 7:02 pm ] |
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trust me mate 1 turbo is enough, and im only running 8pound! and its decompressed to somthing stupid like 7.2:1 
its bloody scary to drive, it spins 3rd on boost sometimes, when your doing 70 ish km'h and this happens, you need to know what the hell is going to happen otherwise you will end up head on into an oncoming car or foot path! trust me! id hate to imagine mine with 15 pound with a aftermarket ecu, 
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| Author: | JC [ Thu May 31, 2007 8:20 am ] |
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Joe, Go the 4EFTE. Why? Its just easier in the long run. However, if you have your heart set on a G13B there are two for sale in Brisbane at the moment. One with a mini subframe modified to suit and one without (a modded subframe). JC |
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| Author: | 65_mini_deluxe [ Thu May 31, 2007 11:26 am ] |
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hi,im pretty sure this has been asked before, but whats are the differences between the 4EFTE and the G13B. I'm looking for a pretty reliable, stock looking, fast road car, with or without turbo. Just something to shock a few people at the lights and the odd blast around a racetrack. What engine would be more suitable for tuneability, perfromance parts etc. Thanks Joe |
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| Author: | JC [ Thu May 31, 2007 11:59 am ] |
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65_mini_deluxe wrote: im pretty sure this has been asked before, but whats are the differences between the 4EFTE and the G13B. Thanks Joe
You're dead right, its been asked alot before.... I haven't yet seen a convincing arguement as to why you would opt for the G13b over the 4EFTE. Initially people think there is more space available with the g13b. That ain't so. |
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| Author: | Mokesta [ Thu May 31, 2007 12:30 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Both G13B and 4EFTE are a tight fit in the roundy engine bay. The Toyota motor is easier to fit but has more appendages to fit (turbo, intercooler). A G13B has less power and no turbo so the total waste heat is much less. Therefore the radiator can be relatively small. Most G13B conversions use a small rad mounted on the passenger side behind the grille. 4EFTE on the other hand has a snail, intercooler and bigger radiator. Even though the donk is smaller (narrower head) the combination is harder to fit into the bay. You'll end up having an IC hanging out the front or a radiator in the boot or some other compromise (like too small IC and rad). With 4EFTE you are also likely to need a bonnet scoop. We have yet to see a roundy 4EFTE do some serious hot laps of a race track and have enough cooling capacity. One can successfully negotiate stop start traffic so that's a good start. G13B gear boxes are said to be weaker and would be more so with foreced induction. G13B delivers 100 hp. They have low compression as std and revs are limited by lifters. If you modify them you can get 130 hp. Space for custom intake and extractors will limit maximum gains. Some off road racers make well more than 130 hp but they have space on their side. Downside is a modded engine with re-build costs and maybe new EFI computer. 4EFTE delivers 130 hp (approx) stock. Up the boost yadda-yadda as per any turbo and you can get silly numbers even without taking the thing apart. Just remember more power + turbo = more waste heat = bigger heat exchangers = more space and weight G13B has equal length drive shafts so less torque steer in theory. G13B has alloy block, no turbo, no IC and smaller radiator = lighter car so direct power comparisons are not really valid. Summary: Max power --> 4EFTE Light & simple --> G13B Easy & originality snob factor --> GR A-series |
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| Author: | simon k [ Thu May 31, 2007 2:15 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
get a micra super turbo and do that.... 930cc with a blower and a snail http://www.autospeed.com/cms/A_2216/article.html |
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| Author: | minimetoy [ Thu May 31, 2007 3:00 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
[quote=" With 4EFTE you are also likely to need a bonnet scoop. We have yet to see a roundy 4EFTE do some serious hot laps of a race track and have enough cooling capacity. One can successfully negotiate stop start traffic so that's a good start. [/quote] That would be mine  And can i say when i drive it in the traffic I do tend to play with it (the car that is). I also feel that i will not have major issues with it on the track but time will tell. The only thing that can let the system down is the flow rate of the water given the small water pump, the solution here would be to fit an electric water pump with a digital controller. I also used a three core radiator and forced the air downwards through the rad, this would ensure that at high speeds the fan was not trying to contend with the stream of air passing under the radiator but in fact assisting the thermo fan by creating a low.
It is all a bit about trial and error and thinking through the process that is occuring. Dan |
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| Author: | JC [ Thu May 31, 2007 3:43 pm ] |
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Can you hear the fan kick in (and continue running) Dan? |
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| Author: | minimetoy [ Thu May 31, 2007 3:52 pm ] |
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JC, Fan kicks in and out as required by the computer. It does not stay on all the time, it does turn itself off. I also have an overide switch on the dash if required but have never used it. Dan |
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| Author: | JC [ Thu May 31, 2007 4:19 pm ] |
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JC wrote: Can you hear the fan kick in (and continue running) Dan?
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| Author: | Spaceboy [ Thu May 31, 2007 4:19 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Mokesta wrote: G13B delivers 100 hp. They have low compression as std and revs are limited by lifters.
g13b has 10:1 compression, and will rev to 8600 with aftermarket chip. also should be much cheaper than a 4efte if thats a consideration. If you want to run a turbo, then the 4efte is a far better choice, its already turboed, it has lower compression so you can run more boost and the gearbox can take more power. Turbo kits for g13b's are expensive, and you can only run low boost without modifications. |
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| Author: | Archangel007 [ Thu May 31, 2007 4:25 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Joe, Having made subframes for both and installed both - I would opt for the 4EFTE. The narrower valve angle head of the 4EFTE is offset by the turbs on the front, so pretty much of a muchness in terms of ease of fitment and compactness. The 4EFTE is a bit newer, also has cast iron block so it can take more of a hiding. Parts for 4EFTE are fairly plentiful, and the gearboxes are nearly bulletproof. In terms of tuning for more power later on, the 4EFTE has greater flexibility in this area and would cost you less to get decent gains. Forget the twin turbo route, leave that to big displacement engines like the 2JGZE, RB28DETT and the BMW335. They need smaller turbo's to reduce lag so they get out of the hole quicker. When you have a car that weighs 650kg wet, you dont need huge mumbo to get out of the hole!! A hi-flowed CT9, or TD04L, T25 or even GT28RS are more than enough! My $0.02 Cheers, Tricky |
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