Jon
The other car would have been Caroline O'shannessy's car. She actually ran with my suspension and brakes in that race. She cooked hers in practice and was appealing throughtout the pits for the use of somebody else components.

Neil mason was the other driver in the Gary Leggat car and Neil and I were in the same class at high school.

back to the point, I wasn't actually saying that clubbies were faster and i wasn't clear there. I was saying that the genre was several seconds faster and it was due to other factors like tyres, brakes, modifications etc.

Mike

Don't forget the engine freedoms but the Clubman was faster down conrod than the roundnose in the same race with the same freedoms

Maso's old wrench Pip Barker had moved on to the Grice team by then and he and i like you and Maso go all the way back he was a first class mini steerer

Jon

_________________
Roundies and Clubbies(except vans) are both ugly that is why I have Midas and a van
1293 Mini Midas Bronze,1275 Clubman van

Protected species ..ya wanna tangle with Brad or Matt etc

_________________
"Show me the Mini!"

Hmm..
I dont fully understand co-efficients of drag - that is I dont understand which way is the better co-efficient - higher value or lower value. Roundies had a lower cd value

I dont really know - I do know that more money means more preparation and a better car to drive and thats usually the difference between drivers of similar talent.

Mick

told em ages ago that the roundies and square fronts are no good when there is a aerodynaic front on mine try and give em something to aim at and they still miss am happy to drive either but really people the only real calssics are the Cooper,Cooper Ss and the GT i mean it like saying A normal falcon is a classic or a 202 Torana is to but we all know which ones people really want hey, knudge, knudge, wink, wink, say no more

watch em bite

Jon

_________________
Roundies and Clubbies(except vans) are both ugly that is why I have Midas and a van
1293 Mini Midas Bronze,1275 Clubman van

Qualifying times for the Bathurst 1000. (the rules changed to group C in 1973)

1973 Fastest Cooper S 3.00.9
1974 Fastest Cooper S 3.00.0. Morris Marina 3.29.2 No GTs.
1975 Fastest Cooper S 2.57.9. Fastest Clubman GT 3.04.5 (Cooper S wins!)
1976 Fastest Clubman GT 3.02.5. No Cooper S entered.

So the Cooper S under Group C rules was quicker than the Clubman GT. The best GT was almost 5 seconds slower than the best Cooper S.

Under the Series Production rules that were used up till 1972 the Cooper S would lap at about 3.30. So the cars gained about 30 seconds a lap from the changes of rules.

I have no bias in this, I am just stating some facts.

The fastest race time not qualifying was a 2.55.84 set by the GT in 75 and in 76 the Cooper S group C 5 year rule made them to old to run besides by that stage that damned Datto of evans was going to bloody fast


Jon

_________________
Roundies and Clubbies(except vans) are both ugly that is why I have Midas and a van
1293 Mini Midas Bronze,1275 Clubman van

......CLASSIC......

_________________
_______________________________________________________________________________

Oh so she had cooper S brakes then
That must have been why



Is that the Ampol Neil Mason?

adding my tuppence worth!

GT fastest speeds accoding to road tests in mags from 1971:
Wheels - 98 mph
Motor Manual - 97 mph
Modern Motor - 98 mph (compared to standard clubbie of 78 mph)
Sports Car World (1972) - 100 mph
i don't have any cooper s reports to relate to.

cheers!
jon

kevin
yeah same guy - he is a farmer struggling with cows up near Armidale now. I spoke with him andhad email swaps leading up to the class reunion back in march.

Caroline's car was a Cooper S not a clubby. She is probably a grandmother somewhere now and although i saw her a couple of times after Bathurst at race meetings I havn't heard of her since I went to the UK. Hers was not a particularly well developed car. All the obvious bits and still road registered back then. She had it trucked to Bathurst but was driving it on the roads when needed.

I find this interesting that the determination for the GT as a classic is people
arguing between the times it ran down conrod straight.

I also find it interesting that people that were not even around at the time of the
GTs launch adding comment to the cars percieved styling at the time.

Read the articles. Read the reviews. The Clubman GT was PRAISED by independant
motoring magazines for its updated interior and excelent performance they also liked the look of the new car too.

Infact, in a long term test of a space blue GT, they finished off the write up by stating that only a Dino Ferrari could possibly replace the car.

Personal opinions aside on the styling of the car, In my opinion, the GT is a very worthy recipient of the 'classic' title. it was quick, looked tough and attracted nothing but glowing praise from all that drove them new.

my 2c anyway

That turquoise 'thing' or the sexy Morris in the reflection?

Okay-Here's the sexy red thing

_________________
_______________________________________________________________________________

from Sports Car World, July, 1966:
Morris Cooper "S" (1275cc)
Top speed average 95.4 mph
Fastest run 96.1 mph


So the GT is faster!
(but not necessarily more aerodynamic)

Oh, & Mike, the lower the Cd the "slipperier" & better.
Some modern cars have a 0.25 Cd

_________________
Too many cars, and too little time.