P platers should not be allowed any forced induction full stop. This with a small capacity limit would work. They could still modify motors but the limits would be fairly low.

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Chris

Everything I like is either
illegal, immoral or fattening.

So if a P-Plater currently owns a high performance vechile do they need to sell the car or do they need to buy a new car which is not a high performance???

This would mean the drivers will not place the P-plate on the car.

but just a thought

The govenment would have to work on a time plan. If you have a high performance car now, that's OK, if you're on your 'P's in 5 years you can't have that car.

Existing high performance p-plater's cars - compulsary impound them till their off their P's - free secure storage - option to sell off from the impound yard.

We need to get tough - no exceptions.

Another 2 needless deaths of P platers in both NSW and Qld TODAY people. This is not an issue that is imposing on some teenager's rights to have some fun, it is an issue that is killing our sons and daughters.

Not the answer....Not picking on skssgn!!

The young sometimes have no fear, ne experience, no sense BUT a huge need to push the envelope to find out "what it is like".

GTR Skyline or Corolla shytebox.....it don't matter.....they will still kill themselves due to a lack of experience, training, discipline and incentive to conform to the road rules (and that one goes for all drivers). More police on the road might help, especially unmarked so long as they apply a little common sense (yeah right...)

Being the Devils Advocate So you have a young kid who has grown up with motorsport, Karts/Mini Bikes etc etc progresses to cars in Motorkhanas...speed events whatever .....here we have a competant driver/operator who values his licence and operates sensibly.....the new draconian laws come along and say "Thou shalt not have that sporty ricer!". Kid is penalised.

The foolish or envelope pushers will still wind their little undepowered, underbraked, ill handling machines to inappropriate speeds for the conditions and (like Heeeeey!) VOILA!!

Lets face it, don't matter what car you are in as you sail over the cliff! (although Volvo had that advert..didn't they)

I have to come down on the side of better training and tough enforcement to get the point across.........but it WILL NOT ever stop the young checking out at an alarming rate

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"Show me the Mini!"

How very true. The problem with driver training is two fold. Finding the professionals to do it is the first and maintaning the skill levels is only done by practise. How do you get the practise? either act like a hooligan on the street or go back to training at very regular intervals. Both have their drawbacks. Any skill deteriorates if not used.

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Chris

Everything I like is either
illegal, immoral or fattening.

This topic needs some positives. We seam to be tearing our hair out and just telling the younguns no no no. Let's add some positive incentives to the mix. Some possibilities?

Gov funded youth motor sport - consessional entry for P-platers. Free fuel at the track. Free access tofully equiped workshops open 11:00 through 21:00 at the track.

Even a positive points system for participation in the above [as opposed to the negative points loss for road rules infringments].
This one could lead into a reduction of provisional licence time,
or a rewards system for more workshop time,
or what about get out of jail free cards for minor road infringments because at least this participant is trying to learn the right way.

Those are all good points, but it should also be considered if the P platers get these skills for track driving, what's to say they don't use them to show off when there's mates in the car.
Maybe the answer is to start educating at a younger age maybe. Again, this comes back to having a little motorbike or go-kart, which builds skills and responsibility. Even RC cars may help, I know I'm not a hoon like most people my age possibly because of it (and I haven't got more than 70KW in my car).

these kinds of laws are good in theory, like most of you have said, but even without the new law insurance companies have been banning young drivers from v8's, turbos and superchargers for years anyway. The problem as i see it is that its meaningless in a lot of cases to ban cars based purely on the number of cylinders. my (only slightly modded) EF fairmont is significantly quicker than a lot of old v8's, as would be most new 6 cylinder cars and plenty of 4's for that matter. Doing it on power-to-weight ratio would be easy enough to work out. as far as power to weight changes from mods go, significant modifications usually need to be approved anyway, so they could have an 'approved for non-p-platers' sort of thing maybe??
Education is the key though - recognizing the need for speed and encouraging it to be found in legal/safer ways (drags, track etc...)

My son has been racing karts since he was 9 and he positively hates being in a car that is speeding and is extremely cautious on the road...he has his L plates. His sister has the opposite view, she speeds if she can.

_________________
Chris

Everything I like is either
illegal, immoral or fattening.

Remember the ban is only for there first 12 months this will allow people who currently have there cars to be out of the first 12 months by the time these laws are introduced. So kids will be able to keep there cars now. Newby's should have enough sense not to buy something they can't drive.
I think the idea about kids learning that there is a place and a time for going fast, ie the track. More education should be pushed in this area. As it is most P platers are under 18 (could be wrong here, it may be 16)and hence classed as a jnr in racing so it is cheap(if 16 then should be made 18 to make it cheap) This could be a really good thing, not just for the kids, but also the motorsport industry, Australia has such a small industry in comparison to others around the world.
Parents should also be aware of the way they drive with there kids in the car. Monkey see monkey do. Obviously peer group pressure has alot to do with it as well.

I would like to see weather or not P plater on this board or even some of the other younger guys would be interested to take out there need for speed at some of the events that are organised by the various mini clubs around australia.
As a member of the MCCof NSW i know that there is a Motorkhana training day on the 16th of Jan, and it would be great to see a bunch of you guys come out and have a go.
As i have said in previous posts,i myself have only gotten into motorkhana's recently andd i have learnt a whole lot about car control etc etc. There are also supersprints and the like organised too, so come along.
i would say for the victorian club contact JAn and she could point you i the right direction. Qld, i am unsure who is the club that does this type of thing.
SA contact Declan Dwyer at the Mini Club of SA or the Hotbricks club. I don't have contacts for all the clubs but it would be worthwhile gong and having a look at least.

Cheers

Aaron

Morris Mini Matic:
32 Horsepower

Weight: 600 kilograms

phew!

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Inconspicuously Conspicuous
Appreciation without Depreciation
forever chasing clearer skies...

I think the other problem is that people can learn to drive in anything. If your dad's willing, you could learn to drive in his lambo. Then the young driver can't live without the power, and goes and gets something that will go fast.

its power on one hand, how you handle it it another, eg for the dickhead who's found himself in a shitty situation, or the person on the other end who's getting caught in

the motorbike "riding defensively" has made me such a better driver
i notice much more to avoid accidents

_________________
Inconspicuously Conspicuous
Appreciation without Depreciation
forever chasing clearer skies...

chris you mention the point to point camra's the have them in vic on the melbourne ring rd
also there are point to point cams for trucks on the pacific new england newell hume great western mitchel and a few other hwys in nsw

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